The immigration analogy for transwomen

[MrsCollinssettled]

Did anyone see the article in Saturday's Telegraph magazine about Diana Thomas? Diana said "I use the immigration analogy because in the same way that immigrants bring to their host nation things from their own culture - food, music, whatever I think I can bring- or we can bring- something new and interesting to the female experience. And I absolutely don't deny the guy in me. I am not pretending I am not still him in many ways."

Diana believes that being female is all about the clothes (says she "has almost caught up on the 40 years of shopping she missed out on") and nurturing "I have earned my way for long enough, so yes, put a pinny round my neck and let me be a homemaker, please!"

Maybe body hair is where the manliness is emitted from and if you remove it you automatically become more womanly.

Like a cyclist. No, wait...

He made and decorated my wedding cake grin I'm not aware that he ever became a woman.

I love that story about your grandad StealthPolarBear.

Not sure if anyone has stated this - but if I went into an West Indian / Bangladeshi etc community centre to state that I (white) could bring something and expand their experience, I rightly would be told to fuck off

Especially if what you were bringing was some sort of 1950s stereotype of their community.

I have heard several TW complain about IPL. FFS you CHOSE to have it done.

Also some women have to do hair removal just to keep their jobs, remember the Dorchester?

As my dear GM used to say, pride is painful.

A friend of mine died in childbirth. In the UK in the 21st century. To compare childbirth to hair removal is obscene. Are we really not allowed to mention AGP on Munsnet? Do we really have to tiptoe around saying what this person is? I'm not going to do that.

This person is a misogynist with a fetish who gets off on minimising childbirth, which killed my friend, in the pages of a national newspaper.

This person is a "coloniser" not an "immigrant". And he is not welcome in my sex class.

Thanks, Errol. Someone copied the whole Telegraph article into the earlier thread. Even with all we now know about transgenderism, it was an education. The absolute obliviousness to reality, the total belief in 50s stereotypes. Michele Roberts clearly saw all this in the review of DT’s book in 1993.

Don't immigrants have to pass citizenship tests? Don't they have to be screened? Don't they have to be accepted? Don't they have to have papers?

And yet, Don't today's trans advocates want to NOT have papers, but just say "poof, I'm now instantly a "citizen" of the opposite sex? Don't they want to say so on the basis of NOT being screened, or chosen, but just on their own say-so? Don't they insist that they don't have to answer any questions showing they know one fucking thing about what women are actually about, but insist they already know all the answers, and more?

Durgas, I am an immigrant from a non ES country (citizen since 2016 ☺) and yes, you need to have all those things and it is a long process. First, you need a visa, then you need to apply for IDLR (that's where you pass a test), then you have to have that for 5 years and then you can apply for citizenship. Each of these applications costs money and takes a long time plus interviews at the Home Office.
I couldn't just say 'Well, I drink tea and am good at queuing so let me in' (if we're going by fulfilling stereotypes meaning you are the thing). So, in short, the immigrant analogy is rubbish.

Also, I don't shave or depilate at all, still an adult human female last time I checked.

Scenario: Foreigner rocks up in the US.
"Hi - I'm brash and fat so I'm an American just like you, but I think you'd all be improved by speaking my language"

That would get you immediate citizenship wouldn't it?

@MrsCollinssettled

That's an interesting question. People with enough money sure enough can fasttrack their immigration process. I suppose with the self-id, the hold the TRA's have on a lot of institutions, and being told unequivocally that TWAW, you might say their immigration process has also been fasttracked.

Here is an interesting perspective from Sian T. It is a rather straight to the point piece.

uncommongroundmedia.com/as-a-transsexual-i-support-dr-eva-poen/

That's such a good article and you can really empathise with her about the impact that the trans community are having on her life as a transsexual.

Havent read the article. But I did use citizenship as an argument when I filled out the self id consultation. I feel Danish, but the danish govt like all other govts decide criteria for who becomes danish. I can call myself danish but I dont get a passport until I have done abcdefg....

Well said Gillian.

Love Gillian 😍

💪🏻 Gillian!!

Gillian.

Gillian rules.

Can Billy Bragg self isolate for 5 mins with Gillian? I think a BB conversion would happen very quickly!

Well said that woman.

@mychardonnaydragon

What I find most frustrating about constant comparisons to childbirth is that the people making them only seem to think about the pain part and not the extraordinary physical effort and physical and psychological aftermath involved.

I tore the meniscus in my knee last year and whilst I would put the pain on a par with labour, I wasn't then expected to run a marathon on that knee which would be a hard enough feat without the injury.

Their view that childbirth is just a few hours of pain to be endured shows that they are incapable of really understanding the female experience.

I am an immigrant and I appreciate that not only are there cultural differences here I am not part of but that it is not the responsibility of the people here to pretend that I am in order to make me feel more like I am one of them.

Yes. Also, after you laser off your legs you don’t get to go home with a baby and look after the baby. You get smooth legs, that’s all.

You also don’t suffer from incontinence, need restorative surgery, get mastitis or any of the other grim complications of childbirth and after.

Rachel Cusk has a line about childbirth and breastfeeding being labour that is requisitioned from women’s lives. The same does not apply to lasering leg hair. Only a pampered buffoon would make that comparison.

And please allow me to be very sceptic of the claim that the pain is the same.

I had one of my children without any anaesthetic, or painkillers. I seriously doubt layering any part of the body is even remotely like it.

I had one of my children without any anaesthetic, or painkillers. I seriously doubt layering any part of the body is even remotely like it.

Im female & havent given birth or had laser hair removal however there will be many women who've done both.
It seems likely that if the pain were comparable we (who listen to women) would all be very aware.
Its reasonable to conclude that it isnt & Thomas does not.