8 year old boy wants to change with the girls

[FairytaleofBykerGrove]

I’ve been informed that a boy in my daughters class ‘feels like a girl’. He’s been wearing dresses to school for a while (fine) and now wants to change with the girls for swimming. Apparently the children will all accept it no problem and they’d like the parents to do the same. He will be under a poncho towel so we don’t have to worry about his privacy(?) I am really very unhappy with this. Which is why I’m up at 3 in the morning. The other parents I’ve spoken to don’t seem to care either way. I can’t understand it at all. Do you have any advice for me?

Can we stop telling girls that having boundaries and saying no is “unkind”.

What a truly appalling message to give young impressionable girls.

Schools should be enforcing safeguarding for both girls and boys.

Not allowing safeguarding to be dropped for any child

Below from the guardian
This is what schools should be concentrating on

Despite all the evidence, the epidemic of sexual violence in UK schools - including 10 assaults and one rape per day - remains low priority. A report from the women's and Equality Committee has not been acted upon.

What a truly appalling message to give young impressionable girls

We really need to start busting these myths that sting quiet means that they dont mind.

Like those stupid judges who think it's not rape if they dont fight back.

Why is everything constantly based on how much fuss someone makes as opposed to whats bloody common sense

I’m with you OP. I’d be in voicing my concerns. This is how it starts. People in positions of trust teaching girls they need to be kind, to have no boundaries and never say no to males. My dds are 10 and 11 and wouldn’t feel comfortable changing in the presence of a boy. They feel uncomfortable changing around their dad. Why aren’t the boys being told to be kind? To accept that this little boy wants to wear a swimsuit. Why are girls and women being told to shut up to accommodate males who are actually the bigots and the cause of nearly all violence. We should be able to say no. The school are setting a very dangerous precedent and are failing to protect your dd. Situations like this feel like they’re becoming much to common now. What is being taught to our young girls and women?! That we can never say no?! That we must capitulate to all men all of the time!

Yes, they absolutely should, littlbrown.

But instead they’re actually making it easier for boys to assault girls by removing boundaries and teaching girls it’s unkind to say no. And you’d better be kind. If you’re a girl.

We really need to start busting these myths that sting quiet means that they dont mind.

Like those stupid judges who think it's not rape if they dont fight back.

Why is everything constantly based on how much fuss someone makes as opposed to whats bloody common sense

Yy, SarahTancredi

Why exactly does the boy want to change with the girls?

If it’s the same reason the girls don’t already change with the boys - for safety, privacy and dignity - then the school needs to ask why the boys’ environment doesn’t provide him with that. And look at third spaces if necessary.
The solution is NOT to infringe on the girls’ safety, privacy and dignity.

If on the other hand the reason is to affirm the boy’s feelings, then that certainly should not be prioritised over the girls’ safety, dignity and privacy either.
OP I would fight this every step of the way if I were you as it’s just the first step in eroding the girls’ rights, and the girls are too young to know this and it shouldn’t be down to them.
Also, despite what you are being told about other parents, remember that there are most of us than you think.

Sorry, I've skipped a few pages reading this.
I wouldn't be happy with this for various reasons.
The boy in question needs to be treated kindly and with respect, but their proposal does not extend that same courtesy to the girls.
It's massively out of order to frame this as the girls not minding and to be kind. The inference being anyone who isn't comfortable is also unkind. That's not on.

I wonder how much mental and emotional energy the girls will have to put into quashing any feelings of discomfort and embarrassment (or even shame) that may emerge while getting undressed in front of this boy? How good will they get at practising cognitive dissonance? What will the long term results of that be?

I think the girls should be able to say no if it makes them uncomfortable. I know that little boy is going through a lot but that dosnt mean the girls should be forced to accept it. I wouldnt feel comfy even at that age I was really private.

I actually think this is cruel to the boy

I agree, LetsSplashMummy. It’s a safeguarding fail when it comes to him, too. The school should be working on the children accepting and including him as an effeminate boy, making sure he’s not bullied for that. He's well liked and popular, so it shouldn’t be impossible.

My DD went through early puberty. The pediatrician told me that the accepted age now for girls commencing puberty is 8. 8 is normal. It’s only any age lower than 8 that is considered early.

This school is setting a precedent that girls going through puberty can be stared at by a boy while they are getting changed
My DD is in high school now. The number of girls who simply don’t show up for school on swimming days or who have a note is huge. We should be doing all we can to encourage girls to partake in swimming. It’s good for them and an essential life skill.

I’d be asking what would happen if any of the girls appeared uncomfortable or reluctant to swim. Or if any parents reported issues at home.

This is a massive can of worms for the school. If this boy isn’t comfortable changing with the other boys and the school isn’t willing to work with the boys to change that the only solution is that he changesby himself. Then he gets the privacy he wants and so do the girls.

And I don’t believe you are the only parent upset by this OP, there will be others. They just aren’t brave enough to stand up for their children in public. I would be incandescent with rage if they suggested it at my child’s school

Actually this is very cowardly of the staff.

Rather than be the bad guys and make the correct decision based on safeguarding (and frankly common sense), they push the decision onto a bunch of young girls.

My daughter is the same age (did swimming last term) and I cannot even imagine our multicultural, outer city school making such a outrageous decision.

As it happens, our local baths say very clearly that no one over the age of 8 is allowed in the opposite sex changing rooms.

I understand that this child may not be happy changing with the boys, but an alternative provision must be made. Our school invites parents to be coach monitors on swim days, so if the school don’t have the staff available to supervise 3 change areas, the boys parents will have to find a suitable adult to volunteer. It’s only a term and half.

I would send a letter or email saying, no, you do not give consent.

And contact the pool to find out what their policy is and what alternative provision they have, so if the school don’t accept your no, you have your follow up response ready,

Of for goodness sake this is an 8 year old. The child is no threat to anybody. Move on

Can you explain what it is that you do not understand about the principle, and practice, of singles sex spaces? Your attitude is very dismissive - and like a form of gaslighting.

Rather than be the bad guys and make the correct decision based on safeguarding (and frankly common sense), they push the decision onto a bunch of young girls
Totally this.

No. No no no.

I started my period at 10. I was wearing a bra by then. The boys had enough fun pinging my bra strap through my shirt at primary. I hated changing in front of anyone, even other girls. The thought of being made to change in front of boys as well actually makes me feel ill. But of course if a teacher had told me I had to I would have done it - because as a child you are taught you do what teachers tell you do.

Why is one child's preference being taken over the majority? Why does this always happen? And why does it always seem to be what one male wants over what all the females want?

Can we stop telling girls that having boundaries and saying no is “unkind”. What a truly appalling message to give young impressionable girls

What we are witnessing is the process of emotional manipulation and gaslighting on an international and ideological level.

It's a huge failure by the peoples involved in these kids lives that they haven't said you can wear a dress but you're still a boy.

I started my period at 10

I was around that age too, I was wondering in P6 or 7 I forget which but it was definitely primary school.

@FireflyAurora You are funny.... because I didn't say HE was the threat I said that the manipulation of the girls IS the treat. Please read what people write properly.

You think it's ok to bully girls into accepting a male into the space? But as long as the male isn't being bullied, all is right with the world, eh?

And "dramatic as usual"... isn't that what men usually say to women to shut them down? Nice.

@CuriousaboutSamphire think about how their newly ingrained lack of boundaries could affect them as adults.

It's the 20s equivalent of being told "he pulls your hair because he likes you"

Okay, so none of the girls have said they minded this popular boy changing with them

Have you been sniffing glue? We don’t ask 8 year olds to write safeguarding policy and carry out risk assessments, so why are they being asked to make the decision?

And "dramatic as usual"... isn't that what men usually say to women to shut them down?

Or hysterical, that’s pretty much always aimed at women.

What would happen if one of the girls wanted to change in the boys room?

This is lunacy. Why on earth aren't they tackling the reasons why the boy is uncomfortable with the other boys or allowing him to change in a third space? I bet this boy has never said he feels like a girl. At most he's probably said that he wishes that he was a girl so people didn't stare when he wore a dress.