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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Dawn Butler and biology

291 replies

HDDD · 17/02/2020 18:35

Clip from GBM interview this morning.
twitter.com/JammersMinde/status/1229439480064610308
She said "Babies are born without sex"
Unless she said something after to clarify what she meant by this or backtracked then I guess this is her starting point....
Astounding. Labour have lost the plot, and me.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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Violetparis · 18/02/2020 11:04

I'm reading 'Identity Crisis' by Ben Elton at the moment. It's a satire on identity politics and is very good and funny, people tying themselves in knots over 'being on the right side of history'. Really recommend it.

andyoldlabour · 18/02/2020 11:08

"The child is born without sex at the beginning - but anyway"

I am not quite sure what to say, except that was astonishing, bizarre.
What is far more worrying is that she is shadow secretary of state for women and equalities.

Violetparis · 18/02/2020 11:09

Do you think any Labour MPs/senior staff read these threads ?

GeordieTerf · 18/02/2020 11:13

Babies are born with a sex, which is either male or female.

But babies have zero concept of gender, I.e. fashion sense. In fact, babies are generally happy in any clothes as long as they're warm and comfortable.

Quite simple really.

If MPs like Dawn can't get their head around this, then what else are they struggling with? I'd be terrified if they were representing us at war or similar! Shock

BovaryX · 18/02/2020 11:28

Do you think any Labour MPs/senior staff read these threads ?

I don't know. But I sure hope Conservative ones are......

BovaryX · 18/02/2020 11:31

Babies are born with a sex, which is either male or female.But babies have zero concept of gender, I.e. fashion sense. In fact, babies are generally happy in any clothes as long as they're warm and comfortable

Well said. It's an attempt to upend and reverse sex and gender so the latter supplants and supersedes the former

CigarsofthePharoahs · 18/02/2020 11:32

So all those babies aborted (or murdered at birth) simply for being girls.... how does that work then? Or the fact China has a serious imbalance in the ratio of men and women nowadays?

Lordfrontpaw · 18/02/2020 11:32

But surely these people should be arguing that babies are born with gender, hence them just knowing to unbutton their baby grows to make a dress? What am I missing?

ThinEndoftheWedge · 18/02/2020 11:38

My third baby moved all the time in utero- wouldn’t keep still - much more so than during my previous two pregnancies - both girls.

Was told all the time ‘it’s a boy’

The boy actually turned out to be girl

  • Is this what Dawn Butler is on about?

My daughter decided to identify as male in utero and was forced to be assigned female at birth??!!

What a bloody idiot.

thecatfromjapan · 18/02/2020 11:39

Just seen a hilarious take on Twitter.

Someone trying to educate the masses as to what Dawn Butler is right.

Apparently, biology is a hegemonic structure which has held too much sway for hundreds of years.

It no longer has a purpose and thus its hegemonic hold is archaic.

Its hold is both crumbling and needs to be dismantled.

ie. Technology will save us.

ie. Biology is cancelled.

Unsurprisingly, it's a privileged male educating the people thus.

Honestly, the people who put this shit forward should be made responsible for going door-to-door selling the idea to actual people.

Not working within the limited, controllable spheres of social media groups or as lobbyists.

But, sadly, we know that ain't the case - and it's why it's managed to get such a tenacious grip.

Siameasy · 18/02/2020 12:14

It’s in the Express now😂

Strangerthantruth · 18/02/2020 13:02

Layla Moran has decided to make a tit of herself again.

twitter.com/IainDale/status/1229698370660438016

SophocIestheFox · 18/02/2020 13:36

Layla saying there that people with disorders of sexual development aren’t male or female.

Lovely. Shall you go and explain that to people affected by those disorders, or shall I, Layla? Go on then, you first, as you’re the one weaponising them in your debate.

Lordfrontpaw · 18/02/2020 13:39

Ah Dr Em.... Layla 'please please stop talking! Its just not funny anymore'

Mockersisrightasusual · 18/02/2020 13:41

Layla is a Physics teacher. What she knows about Biology you could write on an alpha particle.

R0wantrees · 18/02/2020 13:48

Layla Moran, "Anyway. I was hoping to inject some calm and fact into the debate. Alas"

This ^^

twitter.com/LaylaMoran/status/1229727092767707138

Fortunately Dr Emma Hilton is providing both.

-Layla Moran wiki
"Moran studied Physics at Imperial College London and worked maths and physics teacher before becoming an MP. She has served as the Liberal Democrat spokesperson for Education since 2017"

Klinefelters Syndrome (XXY) is specific to males.
Turners syndrome (XO) is specific to females
(this has been taught in schools for a long time)

See recent Mumsnet guest awareness campaign:
DSD Families – The Story of Sex Development
www.dsdfamilies.org/
dsdfamilies provides educational, practical and peer support to children, young people and families living with differences of sex development (DSD)*. We work to ensure that the experiences of children, young people and their families inform best-care practice and professional training. We do this in collaboration with health care providers and peer support networks for adults and families"

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3819388-Intersex-support
www.mumsnet.com/campaigns/guest-campaigns-february-2020

Dawn Butler and biology
R0wantrees · 18/02/2020 13:52
Hmm
Dawn Butler and biology
CallofDoodee · 18/02/2020 13:56

It's unbelievable the batshit things these people are willing to say, the positions they are willing to take in order to continue to 'look good' for... I don't even know who for!

It's like watching a car crash, and it's weirdly fascinating! What are they going to say next?!

'A child is born without a sex' - I mean... 😂😂😂

Themyscira · 18/02/2020 14:04

Saw this on Twitter a few minutes ago. I remain boggled.

Dawn Butler and biology
NeurotrashWarrior · 18/02/2020 14:25

OMG I've only just come across the giraffe quote!

🤣 🦒 😂🤣

BovaryX · 18/02/2020 14:44

What was the context of Dawn Butler's bewildering comments on giraffes?

R0wantrees · 18/02/2020 14:46

Pink News award evening & alcohol I think...

BovaryX · 18/02/2020 14:48

Pink News award evening & alcohol I think...

It's such a bizarre thing to say and Lachlan Stuart's refutation seems much more informed

R0wantrees · 18/02/2020 14:49

The giraffe discussion is at the end of this speech by Dawn Butler MP the shadow minister for women & equalities.
October 2019

R0wantrees · 18/02/2020 14:55

It's such a bizarre thing to say and Lachlan Stuart's refutation seems much more informed

Lachlan Stuart is without doubt more informed than Dawn Butler many of those running for Labour leadership positions.