M&S + John Lewis - your poor Christmas sales will be due to the contempt you've shown your female customers

[Sunkisses]

It's all over the news that M&S and John Lewis have had terrible Christmas sales. I am absolutely sure this is due to the terrible press coverage they received and viral threads of Twitter about how they allow men into the female changing rooms, the contempt they treated their female customers with when we voiced our complaints, and the 1,000s of us who pledged not to shop with them over Christmas. I stuck by my pledge over Christmas and they lost about £1,000 of custom from me with gifts and food. Anyone else kept up their boycott?

Entirely fair. I remain happy to spend in the big retail beasts - I don’t think a pound spent in a local shop is morally superior to a large chain. Everyone’s ethics are their own, and I say that as a small business owner.

I would just prefer the big chains to focus on responsibly turning a profit by selling what their customers want, rather than presuming to lecture us on their rapidly-becoming-dated take on equality issues.

@PurpleCrowbar that great news about your cousin who says that the issue of allowing men in women's changing rooms is being discussed at Area Manager level at M&S and they are shitting themselves about this issue. The boycott continues!

@T0tallyFuckedUpFamily, jeez those sexist and abusive lyrics in the M&S advert! They really don't care do they?

As for John Lewis, they used to be famous for their excellent Customer Service. Their emails in response to my polite but firm ones were patronising, dismissive and rude. John Lewis have just sacked their CEO. I am sure the horrific way their treating their female customers is part of the many reasons she is gone. JL is ALL about the customer service, and they have lost that reputation spectacularly.

Don't you dare try and guilt trip me about lost jobs. If they want our custom back, they need to earn it. Apologise to your female customers, and return the female-only changing rooms by upholding the Equality Act single-sex exemptions.

I would just prefer the big chains to focus on responsibly turning a profit by selling what their customers want

I think I would settle for knickers that definitely haven't been wanked on.
Early last year I would have thought this a given in all shops except those catering to the actual fetish (yes there are some, no dont Google it) it's not even much of an ask, but apparently it cannot be guaranteed.
I'm gypping as I type, cant imagine how bad it will get when i have to go into a shop and buy some.
One thing is certain, it wont be m and s i go in, not solely for the change rooms, but because I cant unsee those reviews.

Quite, floof.

You’ve got to ask how we’ve got from ‘I want to be offered smart, stylish, contemporary, right materials, right price’ to ‘can I have something that hasn’t been jizzed on?’

I've been boycotting since early November - and my weekly shop was at M&S as well as Christmas/birthday shopping so it's cost them a few thousand so far - but I've still got vouchers to spend.

I plan to redeem them at my usual M&S food store - not a penny more - and seek out the manager to explain why, with regret, I no longer shop there. She's usually out and about on the shop floor and always came over for a chat and some feedback when we did our weekly shopping because it's a relatively new store and still trying to establish a regular customer base. I got the distinct impression that the store still hasn't quite got the volume of customers it had hoped for and needs to grow quickly to make it viable.

I will also explain my less-than-satisfactory experience with the stock response to my initial email complaint and the deafening silence that greeted subsequent emails.

She can include that in her feedback to Area.

Just had a quick scroll through their official Twitter feed.

I see the food & drink tweets hugely outnumber their clothing tweets - I wonder if it's because most of the responses focus on reactions to their 'men in the ladies' changing rooms' policy ...

I don't envy the social media teams, currently trying to compose fashion tweets that don't trigger ridicule!

I'd go back tomorrow if they issued a clear statement admitting they'd made a mistake, apologising for the offence and anger it caused, and setting a clear acceptable policy of men only, women only, AND a third mixed space for those who might need help changing from parent, partner etc. And reviewing all spaces for personal security. I hope head office are at panic stations at the moment because I would not want to see a British institution and its staff going under.

They also need to do something about the lingerie reviews on their website. Some of the ones I saw yesterday were really gross and would prevent any sane woman from buying that particular item of lingerie.

They need to relist lingerie back under women's wear too. Having it separate is sending the wrong signals.

I just had a quick look at the M&S lingerie page. Clicked on a pair of knickers at random - lacy Brazilian style. Five out of the six reviews were from men.

Oh M&S, what the fuck have you done?

Fucking hell. I’ve just looked at the M&S knicker pages & a quarter of the reviews I read were from men too.

Well, if that’s the market they’re going for. But ick.

I've been emailed about doing a sparks customer survey for M&S today. Here's the link if anyone else would like to do it...

sparks.inmoment.com/websurvey/2/execute#!/1

I just don't understand what they are thinking with allowing all those male reviews of women's lingerie, it would be easy to not approve them so it must be a conscious decision.

I think I would settle for knickers that definitely haven't been wanked on.

Quite. Over to you, M&S.

it would be easy to not approve them so it must be a conscious decision.

I can confirm they personally approve or refuse reviews. I am 2 approved, 1 refused so far. You get notified if they are approved.

You’ve got to ask how we’ve got from ‘I want to be offered smart stylish, contemporary, right materials, right price’ to ‘can I have something that hasn’t been jizzed on?’
That made me laugh.
I've been wondering just how long it's been going on? From time immemorial or just a few years ago?
I dont actually want to know, and although it makes me feel very sick, I'm glad I know now. But it really is beyond disgusting. Also to know theres probably a few men reading these comments and elated with themselves and the result they got.

Just no 🤢

not envy.

Sexnotgender

Ugh. Ugh. Ugh.

Totally ugh, that was from a 5 minute pootle around the pants section. I’m sure there’s plenty more.

wow.

actually gobsmacked

OP, conversation went a bit like this:

Cousin who is long term M&S manager mostly on Food Hall: apparently feminists are boycotting us! FFS! Can you imagine! Purple, you're one of those bolshy types, do you know anything about this?

Me:

Cousin: That's ridiculous. As if! Purple, what are you smoking these days?

Me: alrighty. Ask your colleagues in ladies' wear.

Cousin: OMG, I thought you were winding me up. I've talked to them & wow, they are NOT happy. This isn't actually happening in my regional store though & obviously it's a bonkers London thing.

Me: I think you'll find it's national policy. Although NOT where I live overseas, interestingly.

Cousin: ah...yes, this is now suddenly massive & everyone is losing their shit about it . Do you still want those short dated turkey crowns?

Cousin is of the opinion that things would have been better left under the radar (apparently the occasional bloke trying on bras has been indulged forever), but now it's all anyone ever talks about in M&S meetings, with the direction of thinking being overwhelmingly that this is an AWFUL idea.

M&S managers know their customers, & how they'll feel about men trying on pants in the cubicles beside them.

Cousin says it's a mighty clusterfuck, based on rumours she hears emanating from higher up, with several stores flat out refusing to comply.

We'll see....

Ooh interesting stuff purple, keep us updated!

Very interesting.

Interesting and actually quite reassuring PurpleCrowbar
We know that there is no demand for this from women - or most men. It has been really disconcerting to think that people working for M & S have suddenly abandoned everything that they know in favour of removing women's rights to privacy and dignity (not to mention safety).
But it's what's happening everywhere - organisations who actively campaign against women's rights and child safety are being given an excessive influence because people think they're being woke and kind. No due diligence or looking at the reality of some of those behind these organisations

If that genuinely is true, it'd be an excellent time for there to be a fresh campaign of concerned customers asking staff whether what they'd heard about men being allowed in the women's changing rooms was true.

Just a little extra push...