Only consenting to receiving medical treatment from a female is not acceptable

[Siameasy]

mobile.twitter.com/Docstockk/status/1198215833006362630

One NHS trust says it’s unacceptable for women to say they only consent to medical treatment from “natal females”. I find this completely outrageous and couldn’t find a thread on it already. Bloody hell!

The backlash against feminism worked hard to convince everyone that Feminists were demanding equality when what we wanted was equity.
The suffragists knew that equality under the law is a trap and so do Feminists today.
"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread." Anatole France

Yes, women are not men and never will be. Feminists celebrate the beauty and power of women as women, not the beauty and power of women as men.

This is only a view that I reached as I got a bit older and saw some of the realities of the world.

An ob/gyn and a midwife. Perhaps they are used to patients screaming...

I meant what sex were they? Presumably at least one was female and they carried on despite you screaming and crying. So, in what way did having a female HCP help in this situation?

The point is that PP wants to be able to request a female hcp for procedures involving her vagina. She doesn’t have to explain or justify that choice to you or anyone.

Yes female hcps can be unhelpful, as can male ones. You are missing the point.

When someone relates a traumatic event and your response is to nitpick details in an attempt to undermine their stated position (which has zero impact on you)? It’s about you, not them.

So, in what way did having a female HCP help in this situation?

It’s not to do with the female HCP being better or even understanding what it is to have female anatomy. It’s to do with them not being a person with a penis. Is that so difficult to understand.

Many women who have been through traumatic events involving men do not want people with penises anywhere near them and not touching them intimately.

These threads are so revealing. Always.

These threads are so revealing. Always.

So depressing how many woman are queuing up to give the rights of other women away to men isn't it?

It’s not to do with the female HCP being better or even understanding what it is to have female anatomy. It’s to do with them not being a person with a penis.

I think it's a bit of both actually, the proportions of each will vary between individual women but I have to say, I'd be very happy never to have a speculum in the hands of a person who hasn't had one used on them anywhere near my vagina ever again. My first experience with male doctor plus speculum was unpleasant enough to rather stick in the mind.

I am on the HCPC register. Their website has details of all cases where a HCP has been reported, investigated and disciplined, struck off or put on supervised practice etc. Many have involved sexual misconduct in some form or another. It really is a problem. Taking away women's right to ask for a female HCP will only lead to this happening more and more. A radiographer (not someone I know but colleagues know as they trained with him) was struck off recently for accessingb patients records and contacting them to ak them out on a date. This is abuse of their position

Sorry posted too soon. The HCPC is there to protect the public from these situations. It is all a matter of public record. The public have the right to feel safe, be cared for by competent staff and complain if they feel a HCP has acted inappropriately or is not compotent. Can't believe those on this thread who are minimising real threats to women's safety and dignity.

And even if any given doctor behaves impeccably there are many women who simply aren't comfortable with a male for intimate procedures. The fact that a certain percentage of any group of men will behave in a predatory way is an additional reason to build in safeguards, but it's not the only or even a necessary reason for allowing women to opt for a female HCP for certain procedures.

For anyone interested here is a link to hearings in the last 12 months. I clicked on a random male name. He was a social worker struck off for inappropriate behaviour. He attended a service user's home at midnight asked to stay the night touched her inappropriately and asked for sex 😱😡
Some males will behave inappropriately and females have the right to say I don't want a male. TWAM so should be treated as such. Protection of patients trumps personal feelings of HCPs at all times and an NHS trust saui g otherwise is abusing their position. I will fight against this for the sake of patients.

Totally agree Prodigal the patient is the most important person in the situation and their feelings are paramount.
I forgot the HCPC link in my last post. Here it is now.
www.hcpts-uk.org/hearings/recentdecisions/

Thanks for fighting from inside the system!

And even if any given doctor behaves impeccably there are many women who simply aren't comfortable with a male for intimate procedures. The fact that a certain percentage of any group of men will behave in a predatory way is an additional reason to build in safeguards, but it's not the only or even a necessary reason for allowing women to opt for a female HCP for certain procedures.

Exactly. Many women placed in this position - especially if they have specifically asked for a female HCP - will feel that their dignity has been violated. They will feel intimidated, degraded or humiliated. They may perceive the situation as hostile and offensive because their needs, wishes and consent have been disregarded.

Wow, that's quite telling @Ohwhatatangledwebweweave

Of the first 5 men I clicked on who had allegations on the record, 3 were for sexual assault of female patients or colleagues.

Crikey

But also, every NHS organisation has some type of public participation/involvement/engagement group.

I'd suggest that as many of us who have time and capacity and energy get on those groups and feedback in a different way to the Trusts involved.

It may feel a bit awkward at first but, given the demographic make up of many of these involvement groups, they're most likely a) to not be aware of these types of new guidelines, and b_ will very quickly understand your concerns and support your feedback!

An opportunity to get involved directly, and help to influence decisions about care not just around women's health but lots of other areas.

Second this. These groups are often looking for members. They are required by law to involve patients in decision making.

bd67th

Apologies, I was basing my experience on the five ob/gyns I’ve had in the past forty years. Three male, two female. The women and one of the men were too “chipper” to my taste.
My daughter and I now see a very quiet, discreet professor (we live on the continent so different healthcare). He explains everything to my daughter so she understands what he’s doing and has been nothing but respectful. The ob/Gyn who delivered my daughter has since retired sadly or I would have stayed with him.

I strongly believe in choice. I am keenly aware that some women would feel more comfortable with a female doctor, HCP, etc. and they should always be free to stipulate their preference.

FWIW we were suggested a male cleaner by our cleaning company a few years ago. We are an all-female household, the cleaner in question was a Pakistani man. I explained at the time that I did not feel comfortable with this and queried how he would feel working for two lesbians with a daughter. It may all have worked out in the end but I ended up requesting an alternative. Our current cleaner/friend is a Moroccan woman. She is a trained nurse but is not allowed to practice here because her degree is not recognised in this country.

I meant to say, every NHS organisation is required by law to involve patients in decision making.

That link from tangled 😱
OMG I looked at names, and saw two people I know. I would never have guessed what was going on in their lives. One told me he had quit his job because of the stress. I know different now. Bloody hell.

An ob/gyn and a midwife. Perhaps they are used to patients screaming...

I meant what sex were they? Presumably at least one was female and they carried on despite you screaming and crying. So, in what way did having a female HCP help in this situation?

They were both female. Them not being male meant that, despite the pain, I didn't have a dissociative episode related to CSA, I didn't flash back to my rape, and I didn't panic.

A much kinder, in terms of using a smaller speculum and using cervical anaesthesia, male gyn (the only one available) had me flashing back, disassociating afterwards, and having a panic attack in the stirrups, just by being male.

It's my trauma, I know it better than you, and I have a much better idea than you of how to manage it, thanks.

Whatever sex they were, whatever size speculum they were using they should not have continued a procedure on someone who was screaming and crying.

A much kinder, in terms of using a smaller speculum and using cervical anaesthesia, male gyn (the only one available) had me flashing back, disassociating afterwards, and having a panic attack in the stirrups, just by being male.

Clymene It's shocking and scary how common it is. And pisses me off so much that us women are being gaslighted and compared to racists for having boundaries.

Whatever sex they were, whatever size speculum they were using they should not have continued a procedure on someone who was screaming and crying.

In hindsight, I agree with you, they should have stopped and offered a lidocaine shot. I know that now because I've had anaesthesia-assisted coil fittings and know that I have a choice other than "put up with agony or have no coil". At the time I thought it was a choice of agony for a few minutes or pain every month for a week (I was getting a Mirena for endometriosis) and pregnancy risk.

That's not the point of the thread though, is it?

The point of the thread is that women have the right to request a female HCP for any reason and have that request granted unless doing so is impossible.

The lovely male gyn is a research professor who has spent his career improving women's options for endometriosis, menorrhagia, and dysmenorrhea. Literally, his life's work is to make our lives better. If I there's ever a man I can trust with my cervix, it's him, and at a logical, forebrain level I try to. Knowing his dedication to women's health didn't stop my hindbrain from registering him as male and reacting accordingly.

Trauma responses aren't under voluntary control and we shouldn't be castigated for having them.