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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Transsexual women face erasure

999 replies

joannegosling2 · 16/08/2019 22:45

It's a fine state of affairs isn't it?

Please - before the administrators axe this post, at least hear me out.

August 2019 - Transsexual women (not the self ID-seeking transgender - I refer to those of us who surgically transition lock, stock and barrel under strict medical supervision but whose narratives have been appropriated by the TG activists and advertised as their own) now being clobbered by feminists, not only here but every where else on the internet too, whether it be on TGN or this new Spinster group I've heard about. I understand the voice of feminism on the latter has reached unseen heights of extremism.

In fact, if I may say, equally as extreme as the trans activists whom feminists have been resisting for quite some time now. But what a difference a week makes. It seems they are now mounting a full-on attack on their own allies - we transsexuals (who are no less
appalled by the behaviour of the transgenderists and feel equally threatened by them), suggesting we are exactly like those same people with no respect at all for women. AND IT IS CATCHING ON.

They insult us further by calling us men and insisting we submit to male pronouns and acknowledge the absurd assumption that we benefit from male privilege (whatever that is, I surely never realized there was any).

For the zillionth time WE are NOT the problem. This entire farce was started by the self ID demands of the TG crowd. It is true - and we recognise - that women are fighting for their rights as never before. But regrettably there are certain feminist agitators who now see this as a golden opportunity to rid the streets and social life of not only
cross-dressing men who seek to enter their spaces but transsexuals too. To this end they have petitioned MPs to scrap the Gender Recognition Act which affords some legal protection to us...which by happy coincidence (though for different reasons) is exactly what their enemies demand also.

So here the two opposing sides have found common ground, and the politicians, having had the wool pulled over their eyes by the TRAs using narratives stolen from us, are joyfully legislating to bring peace and harmony to our troubled society. Cross-dressers will have their self ID on condition they respect segregated spaces and women will be safe from men in their toilets. And we will all live happily ever after.

Not so for us transsexuals. Someone somewhere has decided that we must be the sacrificial lamb to enable this to happen. We must cease to exist as a group. And not existing together with self ID being in place means it will be deemed no longer appropriate to transition via surgical means. Consequently all such treatment, once tailored purely for he needs of transsexuals, will vanish forever.

I hear women repeat over and over that they were never consulted about 'old-school' transsexuals using their spaces like we have done for years. Since in all probability many of you here weren't even born when I had my operation some 30 years ago that would have been rather difficult. And besides I don't recall being consulted about these outrageous proposals to erase me and my compatriots from society. There are certain well-known individuals on social media claiming to be transsexual but who eagerly cow to feminist insistence that they be labelled men. If they are happy to be blokes, fine. But they
certainly do NOT speak for most of us. I will NOT degrade myself in that way just to please others - nor to seek validation.

Personally it matters little whether women accept me or not. They never did when I was trying my best to present myself in the male role either. That used to hurt me a lot. But now I've grown harder. If the feminists treat their allies worse than they do their enemies, then they do not deserve allies. Whilst still supporting women's concerns in general, transsexuals are also entitled to fight for their existence - especially in the face of so many seeking their total erasure.

I believe feminists have singled us out for one simple reason. Thanks to our years of serious and medicated transitioning (unlike the TG community) many of us pass so well women cannot tell should they brush by us in their toilets. (If you have they're most probably cross-dressers). This I feel is what irks them most as it makes it near impossible to keep us out. So the fewer transsexuals enabled to transition, the less will be in their spaces.

I refuse to pay atonement for the sins of transgender activists. I'm sorry but I just cannot accept that from now on we be barred from women's toilets and hospital wards. For I can tell you it will not stop there. Next it will be parks, libraries, shopping centres and schools -
indeed any place where there are children. Apartheid sound familiar?

So know this Mumsnetters. I shall go on using women's toilets as I've done for half my life now. Not because I'm some misogynistic, foul-mouthed lager-drinking bloke who seeks to undermine or abuse women as many feminists seem to relish believing these days, but to
quietly assert my right to exist; you see I do it in the context of the time when black people once sat at segregated lunch counters enduring terrible abuse and violence from bigots.

Feminists can so do their worst. We few transsexuals who are left have nothing to lose now.

OP posts:
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terryleather · 17/08/2019 09:55

On a side note I'm still fascinated by the fact that almost all of these plopping posters have ladies name + number(s) as their user name...is it some kind of code (or am I just hungover)...

TinselAngel · 17/08/2019 10:01

I always use these threads about Erasure to highlight the real issue- that Blue Savannah is very underrated.

Dustybun · 17/08/2019 10:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Wurzelsnewhead · 17/08/2019 10:10

Tinsel 😀
These threads really bring home the TRA view of women- Love to Hate You but they’re riding the crest of a wave on a Ship of Fools if they think we’re not going to stay Stop! Just Have a Little Respect for women. Am I right?

RedToothBrush · 17/08/2019 10:16

These threads really bring home the TRA view of women- Love to Hate You but they’re riding the crest of a wave on a Ship of Fools if they think we’re not going to stay Stop! Just Have a Little Respect for women. Am I right?

Groan

There's a line

I think it's been crossed.

Lamahaha · 17/08/2019 10:20

If I saw * in a women's toilet I would never, ever let them know I don't want them there. I'm not assertive towards rude men, and there's a reason for that.
They would never know; and just assume I don't mind.
I think lots of women are like me. Very few would actively show their opposition; thus the assumption that they pass and women don't mind.

Wurzelsnewhead · 17/08/2019 10:25

Red 😂😂😂
I’ve got plenty more where that came from- although it did distract me from writing my sought after Xmas cracker jokes 😉🥳

Fieldofgreycorn · 17/08/2019 10:27

I would have had more sympathy for op had she just gone and got on with her life quietly, using spaces as she sees fit, and not making veiled threats here.
Her male socialisation is showing.

womanaf · 17/08/2019 10:32

If we take anything from this thread, can it be the ridiculous pomposity if ‘so know this mumsnetters’?

Grin
TinselAngel · 17/08/2019 10:48

f we take anything from this thread, can it be the ridiculous pomposity if ‘so know this mumsnetters’?

I keep being reminded of this:

S1naidSucks · 17/08/2019 10:53

Now I'm going to go and nurse my hangover. I'd be interested to see your responses if you do reply

Peppermint tea or an energy drink. It’s the only thing that stops me from feeling really sick. 🤢

LangCleg · 17/08/2019 11:25

If we take anything from this thread, can it be the ridiculous pomposity if ‘so know this mumsnetters’?

It's all a bit nobody likes me, everybody hates me, think I'll go and eat worms...

... and everyone went go on then.

howdyalikemenow · 17/08/2019 11:33

if I saw in a women's toilet I would never, ever let them know I don't want them there. I'm not assertive towards rude men, and there's a reason for that.
They would never know; and just assume I don't mind.
I think lots of women are like me. Very few would actively show their opposition; thus the assumption that they pass and women don't mind.

^^ this

Birdsfoottrefoil · 17/08/2019 12:04

you don’t ‘pass’ people are just being polite

They are hardly ever ‘being polite’, they are actually being intimidated and are too scared of the reaction to challenge a man in female spaces.

sackrifice · 17/08/2019 12:06

It isn't politeness.

It is fear.

Of Men.

Because we do not know what will happen if we flinch. So we hide.

YouJustDoYou · 17/08/2019 12:16

They are hardly ever ‘being polite’, they are actually being intimidated and are too scared of the reaction to challenge a man in female spaces

THIS. We don't say anything because women who have have been subjected to being punched in the face, being videotaped and put on social media as a "terf", had vile slurs thrown at them and have been verbally abused. It is fear- we recognise you, every fucking time. It's OBVIOUS what you are, and we say nothing out of FEAR.

Ereshkigal · 17/08/2019 12:18

Her male socialisation is showing.

Do you have any conception of how absurd you sound?

Ereshkigal · 17/08/2019 12:20

Barracker WineThanks

TheInebriati · 17/08/2019 12:21

@joannegosling2

I don't hear feminists spreading lies about trans forums such as Angels. If its too much for us to expect the same courtesy from you, then why would we consider you an ally?

FannyCann · 17/08/2019 12:28

Am I the only one that feels rather nostalgic for the days of a good old caught lying, sword of truth, money in brown envelopes type scandal?

Also will someone please enlighten me - what is the dreaded WBH?

littlecabbage · 17/08/2019 12:30

I hear women repeat over and over that they were never consulted about 'old-school' transsexuals using their spaces like we have done for years. Since in all probability many of you here weren't even born when I had my operation some 30 years ago that would have been rather difficult.

Many of us have contradicted your claim that we were not born when you had surgery to (I assume) remove your male genitalia. However, even those who were not born then have the right to speak up now to defend their rights, even if those rights began being trampled upon before they were born.

I myself would have

littlecabbage · 17/08/2019 12:33

Oops.

I myself would have been a teenager, (probably not legally an adult, and so probably wouldn't have had a voice) but I would definitely have been horrified at male bodies in female-only, private spaces. If women had been consulted. Which we weren't.

Ereshkigal · 17/08/2019 12:34

The Weetabix Banana Horror Envy not jealousy

Ereshkigal · 17/08/2019 12:35

Also will someone please enlighten me - what is the dreaded WBH?

That last in response to the question above.

MIdgebabe · 17/08/2019 12:44

I was consulted at work when a man transitioned.

The first day he turned up in a dress ( no surgery at this point) the men refused to allow him in the gents ( like what were they afraid of? )

and then they were totally flabbergasted that the women didn’t want him in the ladies.

One loo was designated as suitable for all.

Compromise that everyone could work with.

This person always demonstrated female socialisation which is evidenced by them not insisting they were a woman
.

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