Shocking behaviour towards lesbians at Leeds 'pride' today

[MrsSnippyPants]

twitter.com/LilyLilyMaynard/status/1158020993006411779?s=20

But transwoman don’t erase lesbians just by existing any more than transmen erase gay men or both erase heterosexual woman/men.

The issue is with some comments that some individual trans people/ activists have made that lesbians should include transwoman in their dating pool.

Many lesbians are happy to attend pride and embrace who they are and enjoy celebrating diversity and LGBT, not all lesbians want pride to become a place for getting the ‘T’ out, any more than not all trans people want to get the ‘L’ out.

It’s a strange place for these arguments and I’m not surprised it’s caused conflict, that’s exactly what the protestors set out to do by attending an event that is attended by many trans individuals and their supporters with placards saying they’re not woman.

To then cry victim because people don’t want them their is ironic to say to least.

The issue is not with lesbians attending, the issue is clearly with wanting to exclude 1/4 of LGBT at pride and turning an event that enables LGBT people to feel proud and represented, into an event wanting to alienate them.

@earlywalker the point of pride is to be proud of your sexual orientation. If that's homosexual what's proud about being coy about the fact? In the beginning lots of homophobes were very offended by exclusive homosexuality and tried very hard to shame Pride marchers. Are you suggesting lesbians should kowtow to the new breed of homophobes in glitter and makeup to keep the peace?

I know it returns >100 links to previous discussions but for anyone who hasn't seen previous FWR threads about Crenshaw and intersectionality:

www.mumsnet.com/SearchArch?mustmatch=Crenshaw+intersectional&dontmatch=&nickname=&src_displ_option=s_m_d_m&fromDate=&toDate=&topicmode=chs&chosentops=5365

Hate incidents and hate crime are acts of violence or hostility directed at people because of who they are or who someone thinks they are.

For example, you may have been verbally abused by someone in the street because you’re disabled or someone thought you were gay.

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/law-and-courts/discrimination/hate-crime/what-are-hate-incidents-and-hate-crime/

The usual tiny handful turn up to disrupt everyone else's enjoyment, get short shrift and yet they're the victims? No doubt they'll claim 'lesbians aren't welcome at Pride' again despite the fact that the overwhelming majority of lesbians there were happily taking part in the parade and had no time for their bigotry.

The only people threatened and excluded from Pride were lesbians.

The Equality Act 2010 names sex and sexual orientation as protected characteristics, and states that lesbians are women who are same sex attracted.

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/notes/division/3/2/1/9

And the phrase 'love who you love' is very problematic in terms of Foucalt, the rise of the 'MAP' and queer theory. Lesbians don't necessarily want to associate themselves with that particular slogan in the current climate. I certainly don't, speaking as a bisexual.

Yes, Early, you think that lesbians should attend pride if they can be compliant and quiet about the specific issues affecting them. Got it.

Yes, Early, you think that lesbians should attend pride if they can be compliant and quiet about the specific issues affecting them. Got it.

Are you always so manipulative?
If you’re attending pride with the purpose of excluding 1/4 of LGBT, don’t cry victim when they don’t want you there.

Nothing to do with the protestors being lesbians (I don’t think they all are either) or lesbians not being able to attend, it’s about turning a pride event into an exclusion event and expecting that to be met with open arms.

If you want to protest then own your shit, don’t cry victim when you’re met with hostility because not everyone thinks the same as you.

If you want to protest then own your shit, don’t cry victim when you’re met with hostility because not everyone thinks the same as you.

Absolutely

Are you two trying to say that lesbians should have to accept partners who have a penis?

If you’re attending pride with the purpose of excluding 1/4 of LGBT

Lesbians have no interest in excluding trans people (assuming that’s who you mean by 1/4 of LGBT) from pride. They have an interest in making it clear that they have no interest in having sex with men who think they should.

Btw, I’ve asked already and you have ignored, do trans people make up 1/4 of LGBT people?

The usual tiny handful turn up to disrupt everyone else's enjoyment, get short shrift and yet they're the victims?

Well when heterosexual men are pretending to be lesbian and getting actual lesbians kicked out, seems a bit sad to call the lesbians 'disruptive' at their own festival/march don't you think? What is the point of 'PRIDE' when it is all about heterosexual men?

Nothing to do with the protestors being lesbians (I don’t think they all are either) or lesbians not being able to attend, it’s about turning a pride event into an exclusion event and expecting that to be met with open arms

You don't think 'they' are all lesbians, but yet you are behind the heterosexual men wanting them kicked out for not accepting their penis? You do make me laugh.

Early, you're saying that lesbians should only attend Pride with the expectation that they can speak openly about their issues and assert their boundaries if they also accept they're going to be shouted down by baying crowds? Fair enough. Nice of you to be so open about your lesbophobia. Makes things clear.

Are you two trying to say that lesbians should have to accept partners who have a penis?

It’s manipulative comments like this that deliberately seek to skim over the actual points in an attempt to discredit what’s actually being said that wind me up the most.

Do trans people make up 1/4 of LGBT people

T is 1/4 of L G B T. I don’t know numbers.

And there’s some of us who are heterosexual who get abused too. So it’s a truly inclusive event I suppose!

If you stand infront of me with a ‘get blacks out’ sign, then you can bet your ass I will argue with you.

Stand outside an abortion clinic with a ‘this is murder’ sign and harrass someone I’m with, again I will tell you where to shove your sign.

Everyone has a right to protest, other people have the right to disagree. To cry ‘woe is me, you all hate lesbians’ because people don’t agree, makes you manipulative not a victim or a hero.

No, no, I dont think Early has said she thinks lesbians should accept penis. She's just said the fact that they don't isnt something they should put on banners at Pride.

T is 1/4 of L G B T. I don’t know numbers.

T is not a quarter of LGBT. It’s one letter in the name. That does not equate to a quarter of LGBT people!

It's LGBTQIAA+ anyway. The numbers are cocked right up once you start adding all the extras...

@MinnieTheSphinx - do you think that it is acceptable for lesbians to be abused and called TERFs, if say that they do not want penetrative sex with a person with a penis? Is it OK to say some lesbians can cope just fine with penetrative sex with a person with a penis - or should sex - even for a woman - be a damn sight better than ‘just coping’?

Is it OK that some trans activists are talking about strategies to breach the cotton ceiling - which is a nice way of saying people with penises want to be able to coerce lesbians into accepting their penises in their vaginas?

Should the women, the biologically female lesbian women just ‘get over their genital hang ups, stop their unhealthy focus on genitalia and happily have penetrative sex with these biological males whose only claim to be lesbians is just that - saying they are?

I am not a lesbian, and I am incandescent with fury at the thought of lesbian women being abused for wanting sex with biological women, and there are people out there scheming how to undermine their free choice.

Why are proud Lesbians and gay men letting the T take over?

Yes pride used to be just that. There was pride in embracing your sexuality and showing the world you are not out to harm anyone.
Since the T took over its all about violence both online and real life.
It's all about an agenda and the bullying they will do to get what they want.
Now pride is more DO AS WE SAY OR WE WILL HARM You.

The gay and bi community need to support their lesbian sisters. The way they supported them in the 80s when communities shunned them and left them to die.

There was a lesbian event in Llandudno the other weekend, no trouble there that I heard of. What a shame that a minority spoil it for others. Looking at the video I would say a lot of students were out today.