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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

This is a good thread about female trans allies

999 replies

Doyoumind · 30/07/2019 16:00

twitter.com/overpow_erin_g/status/1156003798898241543?s=19

Thoughtful insights into how some women get drawn into the wrong side of the debate.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
14
Doyoumind · 31/07/2019 19:01

Why has no one considered how the cats feel about transcats entering their spaces?

OP posts:
Deliriumoftheendless · 31/07/2019 19:04

What if a cat identifies as human?

RosesAndRaindrops · 31/07/2019 19:05

No. People can’t change sex. That’s factual.

Has anybody said you can biologically change sex?
I don't think they have, have they.

RosesAndRaindrops · 31/07/2019 19:08

GC women are enthusiastic about anyone of any sex looking any way they want

Eesh, to come out with that you must have missed the thread about nails a few weeks back or so.
That was a doozy.

Datun · 31/07/2019 19:09

That’s a better idea, Michelle. I’m too tired to start identifying as things.

Haha! I hear ya sister.

things

Honestly, this is the level of debate. And this is where it ends up. 🤣

ScrimshawTheSecond · 31/07/2019 19:10

Women in prison raped by Karen White. Women in prison intimidated by Evie Amati.

Women in shelters while Katie Dolezal is placed there.

Women losing their titles/medals/college places because transwomen are taking them unfairly.

Women scared to access services in case they might encounter a male voice, male body, male presence.

Women told talking about their female bodies is 'exclusionary' and our anatomy should not be mentioned, after decades of feminists trying to gain the power to claim our bodies as our own?

Women intimidated by the precedents of lost jobs, doxxing, police custody, public shaming, who are too afraid to say any of this out loud even though they know fine well that nobody with a penis will ever be a woman, no matter what hormones they take or what operations they have?

Considerate, thoughtful, tolerant women now having to attend meetings in secret for fear of attack? Women who've worked for years to defend the vulnerable, keep their kids safe, escape violent or abusive marriages, now silenced by the 'feelings' of some man who doesn't feel happy in his body. Or does, but thinks he has female essence that means his penis is different somehow than other penises and women should magically know that? Men who think a frock and lipstick mean they share female experience? Their IDEAS about being a woman somehow equate to years of period pain, labour pain, pregnancy, birth, breastfeeding, domestic violence, rape, sexism, and all the rest of the shit we have gone through by virtue of being female?

No.

PetrolBastard · 31/07/2019 19:10

No, I'm not new. Hence totally unsurprised by the way the question how would you feel if you were in a different body has been neatly avoided. Much easier to engage in a little light humorous fantasy than actually admit that you would feel pretty weird if someone stuck a dick on you.

PetrolBastard · 31/07/2019 19:11

No, no one has said you can change sex. But of course that won't stop it from being a cornerstone of their argument.

RosesAndRaindrops · 31/07/2019 19:12

Honestly, this is the level of debate.

Yep, and it's telling that it always ends up back on the roundabout so you can patronise and do your laugh emoticons when the bloody thread wasn't even about define women lol, they all go exactly the same way.
It's gone back onto the circular roundabout, all so presumably you can ignore the fact that some say women who don't agree with them are cowbag bitches.
How is that feminism?

Datun · 31/07/2019 19:13

No, I'm not new. Hence totally unsurprised by the way the question how would you feel if you were in a different body has been neatly avoided.

When your argument invokes Freaky Friday, you're nowhere.

Seriously.

No fucking where.

RosesAndRaindrops · 31/07/2019 19:13

Hence totally unsurprised by the way the question how would you feel if you were in a different body has been neatly avoided.

Yep, same.
Never any engage, it all goes back to the eye rolling, patronising, laughter bollocks.
I don't think they're capable of engaging.
Some are just totally bizarre.

RosesAndRaindrops · 31/07/2019 19:14

If you say so Datun.
Wouldn;'t have expected you to even try.

PetrolBastard · 31/07/2019 19:14

Why don't you try answering the question? You don't have to tell us what you think. But why don't you try asking yourself if you would really be OK in a male body?

Datun · 31/07/2019 19:14

How is that feminism?

Define it. I'll play it.

Datun · 31/07/2019 19:15

Define feminism, roses.

Doyoumind · 31/07/2019 19:15

Why do the obtuse always ignore the assertions that it doesn't really matter what people feel they are and that generally on here we don't have a problem with people living that out, but in legal terms we require definitions and women's sex based rights need protecting? It just sends the thread in the inevitable circle every time.

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RosesAndRaindrops · 31/07/2019 19:16

Jeez, another question avoid.
Just why? Is it OK to call women who don't perform "right" or think "right" cowbag bitches?
Are we not allowed to be capable of own thoughts and opinions?
Don't think that's any better coming from other so called women than it is from men.

JessicaWakefieldSV · 31/07/2019 19:17

how would you feel if you were in a different body

Not just a different body, a different sex. You’re asking us to imagine something that can’t happen, for the purpose of what? TRA’s want to force women to accept males into their spaces on their say-so because to decline is to cause them distress and violate their rights to identify as whatever they want. Something you agree with.

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 31/07/2019 19:17

No, no one has said you can change sex

Well, no one except you @PetrolBastard

I said ‘humans can’t change sex, thems the facts kid’

Then in your post at 18:46 you said

And nothing you've said is a fact. That's your opinion

Hence where the confusion has arisen that you think humans can change sex

You don’t think that then?

Datun · 31/07/2019 19:18

Jeez, another question avoid

Strewth Confused

Define feminism.

PetrolBastard · 31/07/2019 19:18

I'm pretty sure feminism isn't propagating the idea that women are inherently naive and obsessed with their physical appearance. And yes, I'm pretty sure calling each other cows ain't it either, chief.

Endofthedays · 31/07/2019 19:18

Petrol, I’d actually love to have a dick.

But that’s not the same thing as ‘someone sticking a dick on you.’

Who? A serial killer?

You have a really messed up way of thinking.

ScrimshawTheSecond · 31/07/2019 19:18

try asking yourself if you would really be OK in a male body

But that's an utterly ridiculous thought experiment. 'I' is a collection of experiences, feelings, thoughts and hormones that is inextricably linked to my female body and its lived history. It is not and would not be possible for what I call 'I' to exist in a male body.

I don't believe in souls, spirits or essences. Do you?

JessicaWakefieldSV · 31/07/2019 19:18

Why should anyone feel obliged to engage with nonsense?

Goosefoot · 31/07/2019 19:19

I'm not sure nationalities are a good comparison. It is possible to change nationality. It isn't possible to change sex.Your sex isn't something you 'identify as' it is something you are, and would be even if you were severely disabled and unable to verbalise at all.

You can, to a point. In so much as we've abstracted it to be a bit of paper. But can you really take a Frenchman and make him something else, or will he always, in a sense, be a Frenchman?

Your sex is what you are, but we all I think take on certain kinds of awareness and looking at ourselves in a certain way, our sense of belonging to a particular group. If you have a sense of solidarity with other women, that's something different than just having a sexed body, for example.

We seem to have a significant capacity for creating identity with all kinds of different groups, based on biology or other things.

I think this is a capacity that's become a little weird in recent years, so maybe that feeds into this idea that a change in our sense of identity should mean we recognise some more basic change.