Laurel Hubbard wins gold

[TundraDweller]

Gearing up for the Tokyo 2020 Olympics -

www.stuff.co.nz/sport/other-sports/114222068/laurel-hubbard-wins-gold-at-pacific-games-after-losing-name-surpression-battle

I’m pleased Dan Leo has spoken out ( he and I were born in the same place in NZ ) but I would say that he’s a hypocrite for saying men are all silent about this... what like you all are Dan about your mates that play rugby and beat their wives and girlfriends? Never heard Dan say a word. Similarly, he’s only speaking out here because it’s affected his sister.

Juells I do respect Laurel Hubbard as a person, but what I do not respect are her actions in ignoring the unfairness of competing against young women weightlifters,

I agree with Professor Heather that not enough thought went into the decision to include transgender athletes into male and female categories. The result for women athletes has been most unfortunate.

I can’t respect that.

I respect the fact that Hubbard has human rights, just like the rest of us. The mark of a civilised society is that human rights are extended to all, not just decent people. I do not, however, respect Hubbard in any way, shape or form. Hubbard is a cheat.

OtepotiLilliane42
I do respect Laurel Hubbard as a person

What is there to respect? The smug duper's smile when they're on the podium says it all. They're cheating, they know they're cheating, and they're enjoying the fact that the vanquished women are powerless to complain without looking like bad sports.

It’s like when a kid you can’t tell off (for whatever reason) steals your chocolate then stares you in the eye, all chocolatey hands and mouth and says ‘I didn’t take the chocolate’.

They know it...
You know it...
They know you know it

“I’ve been blessed with a pretty much perfect body for downhill; not too tall with good natural strength, which helps.
...
2018 Devinci Wilson XL frame. “I’m 5’10 and like a big frame.”
Rockshox Boxxer team fork, with a firm spring.
Rockshox Vivid R2C Shock, with a 400lb. spring.

What a surprise that the set-up for the bike needs somebody with a very strong physique to manage it. 5'10 with "good natural strength" and, I should think, naturally stronger bones that resist fracture in accidents - plus no need to count calories (unlike most hard-training female athletes) it's uncanny. It's almost as if being strong-willed with the self-discipline to maintain a training regimen that would injure smaller, less naturally strong people, with hormonal cycles that make some injuries more common, is not the whole picture.

"I can’t respect that."

I second that, and would add that I do not respect McKinnon, Weatherley, Abreu, Mouncey or any of the others who lack any empathy towards girls and women.

In the latest podium photos they've upped the 'fuck you' ante by not even bothering to try and look female. It's gut-wrenching to see the two women looking so downcast.

I have no respect for anybody who knowingly takes something they don’t deserve and this rich kid had his homophobic daddy’s money to help him engineer this situation. Nobody gets a free pass because they might have suffered elsewhere in their life.

Hubbard deserves no respect at all.

“I’ve been blessed with a pretty much perfect body for downhill; not too tall with good natural strength, which helps"

Hmm... I wonder why that could be. Genetics? Childhood nutrition? I will just ponder that for a while whilst sidestepping the giant, trumpeting elephant in the middle of the room.

I'm sorry but actual LOL at that comment Fermats. Sounding so super dysphoric as they celebrating their perfect, blessed body for giving women a giant crushing fuck-you.

How much do you bet that Hubbard considers themselves a genuine victim compared to those women. On second thoughts, nobody would take the bet as it's obvious that's the case. "I'm brave and stunning and have overcome such terrible obstacles in my journey to becoming the real Me".

On the "not too tall", and "5 foot 10" thing, this is quite interesting.

Average height for a woman from New Zealand is about 1.64m
Standard deviation for women's heights is about 6.1cm
5 foot 10 is 1.78m

So whatsit the downhill racer is more than 2 standard deviations above average female height. That's comfortably into the top 5% of the female population. You'd only describe that as "not too tall" if in fact you were comparing with a different population.

Again, I find myself pondering which population that might be. Giraffes? [crunch] Oh, I seem to have collided with a random elephant. [lightbulb] Elephants! That'll be the population relative to which 5 foot 10 is "not too tall."

My head is filled with a soundtrack of Beavis and Butthead going "heheheheheh jerk and snatch hehehehehe"

FermatsTheorem - genetic serendipities like this are a marvel and leave us Morlocks reeling at the effortless superiority of the Eloi.

The 'not too tall' comment does not, in fact, reference the bull elephant in the room. It is a factual statement about how the physique of an athlete is appropriate to their sport. In this case it's about levers. Long legs are advantageous to get good speed and force on the pedals. How do you get longer legs? By being taller. But if you're too tall then the leverage of the long legs on the long back can be disadvantageous. This applies for both sexes. So they're quite right regarding not being too tall.

However.

If I were to try and pin down [the reason I was able to do so well], I would say my work ethic.

Really? Could it not be something to do with the fact that leg length to back length ratios differ between men and women, and, having transitioned after the male growth spurt, this person competing against women is both taller and longer-legged than them? (And narrower-hipped, thus pedalling more efficiently and more forcefully than the women athletes. And having all the other physiological advantages of male puberty.)

“I’ve been blessed with a pretty much perfect body..."

Then in what way is it the wrong body?

If it is, in fact, pretty much perfect.

It’s cheating pure & simple & no different to the drug cheats. I don’t respect Laurel Hubbard or any of the other biological males competing in women’s events. They all know exactly what they are doing.

Samoa 2019 chairman says transgender lifter's involvement at Pacific Games is "unfair"

www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1082150/hubbard-participation-in-games-unfair

Loau then reportedly claimed Samoa should "utlise the opportunity" by inviting transgender Samoans and Fa'afafines to join the country's weightlifting team

Fa’afafine have been an integrated part of Samoan culture for centuries

The non-binary term roughly translates as someone who lives "the way of a woman

So already toying with the idea of finding their own "trans" athletes to compete. This could escalate fairly swiftly!

This could escalate fairly swiftly! Bring it on! In time for 2020 Olympics.

Yet another XY puberty body atop the podium in XX sports.....

We're supposed to just accept this?

Kate started taking hormone blockers and estrogen three years prior to racing in a women’s event and she has met each of the IOC and UCI regulations for a transgender athlete to compete in elite level women’s events.

Doesn't mean the regulations are fair Kate.

IOC guidelines seem to allow for required T levels to be revisited:

2.2. The athlete must demonstrate that her total testosterone level in serum has been below 10 nmol/L for at least 12 months prior to her first competition (with the requirement for any longer period to be based on a confidential case-by-case evaluation, considering whether or not 12 months is a sufficient length of time to minimize any advantage in women’s competition )

i.stuff.co.nz/sport/other-sports/114291291/otago-university-researchers-call-for-new-sporting-categories-due-to-trans-athletes-unfair-advantage

Researchers claim testosterone cap won't fix trans athletes' 'unfair advantage'

New Zealand researchers say trans athletes have an "unfair" advantage over other women and sport needs to fix binary gender categories.

Samoa had a trans athlete on their silver winning squash team, www.samoaobserver.ws/category/sport/45451

And JessicaWakefieldSV you put it so well, I've gotten into trouble for suggesting that its homophobia (I didn't put it nearly as well as you), I also got in for trouble for saying I think that because NZ were the first to 'give' women the vote many consider it all sorted and that we rest on our laurels.....I may have been over stating it a little