Harry the Owl and others launching high court battle

[Nephilim1964]

Link to story below

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7018915/Businessman-launches-landmark-High-Court-battle-overhaul-official-rules-hate-crimes.html#comments

yes you can think what you want, but you can never have the right to say, do or post anything offensive.

Number one - Don't be ridiculous. What on earth kind of police state do you want people to live in???

Number two - The police actually told Harry they wanted to check his thinking.

And as for the rest of the straw man arguments and your family's lives - dear lord, what on earth has that to do with anything?

Do you seriously expect people to go oh your kids are decent, therefore we shouldn't have free speech?

Cripes bonkers frothing

I’ve donated to the crowdfunding. DS is a police officer. He joined to help people and protect them from crime. Not to tell them what not to think.

Here's an idea, instead of suing Humberside police, why don't you speak to T May, Penny Mourdant, Sajid Javid, Boris Johnson or the other 8 who will should lead us.
Or the shadow cabinet, you know the 650 people who make the law of the land, and the highly paid lawyers who give advice on the law to the College of Policing, who then tell Humberside. West Yorkshire, Essex, Scotland Police services how to police our country.

But no you'd all rather sue the police.
Here's a thought have you gone and spoke to your local police team, all have local surgeries, have you invited your local force's community team to speak to you, asked their cadets to come to our meetings. Because you know what most will jump at the chance, to talk and explain why and how they police you.
Humberside Police community is made up of virtual all ladies, they are truly desperate for things for our cadets to do and engage with.
The cadets are there to engage with the local community and show them( the community) that policing is like and for them.

Like I said my 2 cadets in 3 years of the cadets have
Helped train new recruits with interview, arrest and venerable persons training, helped with firearms training, riot training of officers.
Spent time on the beat with officers attend local blues and twos day, regional emergency services day, pride, numerous Sikh and Buddhist events, Muslim celebrations, night-time challenges, 100's events with local youth offender teams. Been to WI, local High Sheriff's dinners, charity fundraisers, worked with local school kids, taken children in care on outdoor adventures.
They give feedback to their leaders and the force SLT. they help to give the force what it's community sees as important.
My son gets about 3 invites every week to attend things.
Guess what not one women's group or feminist group have asked for their presence or bother with them.
You know what the kids my boys have worked with, the lgbt ones they meet and the ethnic minorities they talk too are very similar to feminists and all have similar fears. But instead of working with them and your local forces, you run off to the courts.

Is it any wonder my kids think more of lbgt, Sikh's, Buddhists etc, at least they have the guts to talk to them and engage with them. Our cadets just see you constantly posting SM messages about how shit they are and how they work for the enemy.
Any wonder they have little respect for you.

is it any wonder my kids think more of lbgt, Sikh's, Buddhists etc

It isn’t their job to select which communities they ‘think more of’.

any wonder they have little respect for you

Very concerned at this attitude. Again, you really should not be promoting a police culture that is based upon prejudice and a lack of respect for any community they serve.

Are you reading any of the replies here? Or are you just here to bark at women?

This crowdfunder seeks a judicial review into the guidance by the College of Policing.

Harry's not personally suing your sons, you know.

any wonder they have little respect for you

Yes, that's been made clear, and that's why we're supporting this action to challenge this sort of things. The police should be apolitical, impartial, and they should not be investigating non-crime or thought-crime.

You see, we are entitled to not be judged by your sons, PC Gul, or any other police officer for our legal thoughts and social media posting.

Look I have read all your posts, its all about free speech and your rights to be GC, I get that.
But my boys have grown up with openly gay, lesbian, bi-sexual and yes shock horror non binary and trans school mates and friends. They have friends who have 2 dads, 2 mums, a mum and a trans mum.
In their cadets there are two openly non binary and one trans cadet.
One of their leaders is a trans women (full operation), an other is in transition female to male. To them and their friends its everyday life.

So why should my kids respect you if you post messages say their friends aren't real.
Do you expect them and us, to call their leader sir or he, when clearly they are she and Ma'am. Because that's rude and hatred.

My son said when you say to a non binary or trans person you can't be that, so no your not a women your a man, you are saying they are not real or actually you are saying they are less human/non human compared to you. That's not free speech, to them, it comes from a place of hatred. It what the Nazi's did to Jews, it's what communist's did to non communists, what dictators' done to non supporters. You by speaking your free speech, are making others less welcome in our society. You can think it, but once you put out into the world, that's what are doing.

My best mate hung himself at 16, because he was gay, we all knew, best goalkeeper we knew, best person to keep you secrets, would fight anyone who pick on you, a true friend. But his mum and dad, said all gays where perverts and not human. So one day after his 16th birthday he hung himself, with the note saying I don't derserve to live.
I have never believe that shit, and no it isn't free speech it's hatred and bigotry. So you continue saying trans aren't real and I continue to refuse to back your free speech.

Here's an idea, instead of suing Humberside police, why don't you speak to T May, Penny Mourdant, Sajid Javid, Boris Johnson or the other 8 who will should lead us.

You can't be serious. Do you know anything abut this issue? Anything at all???

You do understand, don't you, that every MP in the land has been lobbied, relentlessly.

That there is cross party support for sex self identification? That Jeremy Corbyn has admitted his party is breaking the law?

That women everywhere are threatened, hit, fired? That tonight, just for speaking, a woman's advocate was attacked?

And no-one is suing the police. The money is going straight to lawyers to call for a judicial review into guidance that has lead PC Gul to believe that a man's body can be grown around a woman's brain, for heavens sake.

And it sounds as though you are just as ill informed.

Look I get you don't approve of trans rules, I don't agree with self ID, but then again all the trans people I know and have dealt with aren't self ID'ers. They are full post operation or in final stages of transition.

The bit I disapprove of is this faircop campaign. The police do not make the laws, its your government. The police implement the law.
So Harry the Owl posts a re-tweet of a poem, an unfunny one and some say a shit one.
A citizen of the Uk complains to a police force and says it's offensive to them as a trans person, which I believe they are a protected characteristic under the harassment act of 1997. The report gets logged as a possible hate crime/incident, it is investigated and Harry is rang by an officer and ask why he posted it, officer says ok and agrees no crime, incident is recorded as hate incident on police database. why is that wrong, why shouldn't the police investigate it and ask?
Because if he had re-tweeted a crap poem about lesbians/gay/black/travellers/Muslims/all women been cheap/all women are worthless etc. I bet you would want the police to investigate it and ring the poster to ask, or would you not?

So to me, it is only because Harry posted a poem on your beloved GC that you support him and also all the others, because they all, are GC supporters.

SO here's my question if it was to support Danny Baker against the police/bbc or George Galloway against talksport or the brexit party knob who posted rape comments to a female MP, would all of you given your money?
I bet the answer is no and I bet most, I hope most would expect them to speak to a police officer too.
If you wouldn't give to them or a neo-Nazi, if they set up a fundraiser, I certainly won't, you aren't interested in free speech, you are hypocrites.

I wish you well, but please be honest, this isn't about free speech for all, it is just for your pet project, and that's why I don't support you, because I don't support free speech for racists, bigots and thugs. I can't pick who deserves less to be free to be abused.

As Humberside say, if people report a possible crime and we ignore, we send them the picture we don't care. But they do.
If you drive around Hull you will see 2 pride supporting cars, but there are at least 10 DV issue cars in the same area, so you see Humberside can and do support both women and trans.

I remember when police officers, from a time when Harry was one, who wouldn't deal with DV, it was a man's right. Wouldn't take seriously attacks on gays, they deserve it. The modern police force, which even it admits gets it wrong, is ten times better then that. Humberside have sacked at least 4 officers for failing to deal with stalking/rape and similar issues, all where older officers.
The culture of policing is changing, has Harry found out.

The lbgt, bame and DV victims we know all say not soon enough.

Fight self ID. But don't be hypocrites. One man's free speech is another person's bigotry.

There is a constant need to conflate issues because the whole TRA agenda is so misogynistic and harmful to women and girl's rights. Well 2Boys I've been assaulted for standing up for my gay mates and had rocks thrown at me protesting against the National Front so quit trying to portray anyone with the critical faculties to see the issues with trans activism as a right wing bigot.
The speech below has been reported as hate speech. Please read it and either explain why or understand why we are taking a stand on this issue of using the police to stifle entirely valid debate.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3595007-Leeds-Councillor-thanks-Mumsnet-FWR-in-gender-critical-speech

A citizen of the Uk complains to a police force and says it's offensive to them as a trans person, which I believe they are a protected characteristic under the harassment act of 1997.

Having a GRC is a protected characteristic. About 5,000 have been issued in the UK. Either a seriously disproportionate number have wound up in the Humberside police cadets, or some of those you refer to are self-ID. Which is in essence what the whole debate is about. If the Humberside police are assuming self-ID IS the law, then their interpretation is wrong. Which is why police interpretation needs to be challenged.

My son said when you say to a non binary or trans person you can't be that, so no your not a women your a man, you are saying they are not real or actually you are saying they are less human/non human compared to you.

There is a difference between sex and gender. Almost everyone (unless they have a specific medical disorder) has either XX or XY chromosomes. That determines their sex. Gender is a social construct and honestly it can be whatever you say it is. It is, essentially, a belief and people can believe what they want. Women want to preserve sex-based spaces. Saying people cannot change sex is not saying someone is not real. How can it be? You cant change your chromosomes or basic biology however much extreme surgery you have or hormones you take.

Again it is important to clarify police interpretation of the law around sex and gender and protected characteristics.

Guess what not one women's group or feminist group have asked for their presence or bother with them.

Surprise, surprise. Most women are busy working and paying the taxes that help fund the police, raising children, looking after elderly parents, etc. Most live ordinary lives and don't belong to groups. As for inviting cadets. It is a pity that your boys don't seem to have the contact with women in their lives that would help them understand the importance of single sex spaces such as prisons, refuges and leisure centre changing rooms. My understanding is that it is difficult enough to organise meetings of groups such as WPUK or FPFW, with meeting locations given out about an hour in advance, without informing the police in advance. (Not that such meetings are illegal, the problem would probably be a fear that given the apparent police interpretation of the law around hate, it would be an invitation to have the meeting closed down, or that word would get out to protesters.)

Again a reason to clarify that the police are correctly interpreting the law. If they consider stating biological reality as a hate crime, this is a serious constraint on free speech.

This is not about Harry. This is about how the police interpret rules around free speech.

Your posts have been useful as they appear to reflect accurately the current thinking within the Humberside police. I believe this thinking is wrong, which is why I contributed to the Faircop campaign.

So why should my kids respect you
I don’t think you’d ask that if you had daughters.

The police do not make the laws

Humberside have.....

Have you been following this issue 4boys ?
Did you read Penny M's web chat where she studiously ignored the elephant in the room?
You still advising us to go and talk to them? Where, when, how? They have their fingers in their ears. Are you aware of the prison debacle presided over by this gov where fully intact , no GRc men have been transferred into women's prisons?
The police too has been acting as though self-id is the law. They need challenging.

This speech/thought policing only works the one way. Endless rape, death, violence threats are left alone but a silly poem is followed up?!!

Sorry! 2boys

My son said when you say to a non binary or trans person you can't be that, so no your not a women your a man, you are saying they are not real or actually you are saying they are less human/non human compared to you. That's not free speech, to them, it comes from a place of hatred. It what the Nazi's did to Jews

🙄

God, there is no hope for our police force. What utter drivel.

Biological reality is not Nazism. Seriously, 2boys, it's really not.

And incidentally absolutely loads of women who post here are gay. Gender non conformity goes hand in hand with being CG. Trans people also post. And whilst we're about it, transgenderism is deeply homophonic.

Stonewall utterly refuse to accept that homosexuality is based on same sex attraction.

Most feminists are left wing. They align themselves with minorities, support them. Always have. Do you really think they've all turned into right wing bigots overnight??

Plus as a previous poster points out there are hundreds of thousands of transpeople, but only 5000 with a GRC. Therefore the chances of self identification amongst those you know is almost guaranteed.

You really don't know what you're talking about.

I'm a nazi for believing this is a man? A convicted rapist who sexually assaulted multiple women in a female prison?

Surely police cadets are under 18? Personally I'm surprised that Humberside police are involving children in such activities described, given that the VPC website suggests they will be doing things like supporting older members of the community understand cyber crime, fund raising for charities and road safety campaigns.

I would have thought employing children to advise minority groups about 'hate crimes' would appear to be beyond their remit.

vpc.police.uk/about-us/

Speak to Penny Mordaunt

Now I've heard everything. There really is no point carrying on with this, is there?

My son said when you say to a non binary or trans person you can't be that, so no your not a women your a man, you are saying they are not real or actually you are saying they are less human/non human compared to you.

Can you explain more about this, how is refusing to believe a fiction, while perfectly respecting the persons right to present how they with causing them to be less human?
Are you implying being a man or a woman is a less in your mind?
That's disgusting.

You've just admitted your son thinks there is a hierarchical status for humans, then said we are Nazi's.
Think about that for a while.

What utter drivel.

Yep. No other purpose than to splatter the board with histrionic claptrap driven by an absolute entitlement to demand the compliance of women. And absolutely no self awareness to understand this either.

Pointless engaging.

My son said when you say to a non binary or trans person you can't be that, so no your not a women your a man, you are saying they are not real or actually you are saying they are less human/non human compared to you. That's not free speech, to them, it comes from a place of hatred. It what the Nazi's did to Jews

You are PC Gul and I claim my five pounds

My son said when you say to a non binary or trans person you can't be that, so no your not a women your a man, you are saying they are not real or actually you are saying they are less human/non human compared to you.

How can calling someone a man be saying they are “less human”? Men are humans.