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Original poster

Times 16/2/1/9 Staff at trans clinic fear damage to children......

137 replies

Melroses · 16/02/2019 18:25

www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/staff-at-trans-clinic-fear-damage-to-children-as-activists-pile-on-pressure-c5k655nq9

Does anyone have a share token?

OP posts:
RedToothBrush · 17/02/2019 16:40

For treatment to be ethical it must
a) have informed consent
b) be free from undue pressure from friends, family or any other group or individual

How is this possible atm?

Does this not mean pretty much all medical transition is deeply flawed and unethical in the UK atm? And if it is unethical should the plug be pulled completely and only counselling legally allowed for under 18s and anyone deemed in some way as a vulnerable adult?

I've said for some time that in terms of safeguarding, medical ethics were utterly fucked in this area.

Interesting to see a report brutally spelling this out. It means that the NHS is vulnerable to getting its ass sued off somewhere down the line.

I'm guessing no one will do anything until that point. Cos politics.

OldCrone · 17/02/2019 17:30

In its statement the Tavistock says:

The service prides itself in taking a perspective on issues of gender identity which is independent, open-minded and based on the needs of an individual young person.

On their website they also say:

The Gender Identity Development Service (GIDS) is for children and young people, and their families, who experience difficulties in the development of their gender identity.

I am troubled by a health service which is promoting the idea of the development of a 'gender identity' as a positive thing. This is an ideology which appears to cause nothing but confusion and distress, particularly amongst children and young people. What is a 'gender identity' other than a part of personality which 'feels' more masculine or feminine? Why should it be important to 'develop' such a masculine or feminine part of one's personality? What purpose does it serve?

FloralBuntingIsObnoxious · 17/02/2019 18:17

Quite. 'Gender identity' is pure religion. Is there a similar service funded by the government that helps young people find out which God they believe in?

Mner2019 · 17/02/2019 20:55

It is amazing that Gilligan has had access to this report. Well done to him and the times for continuing to ask extremely pertinent questions when so many others are scared of facing reality. Some of the statements are very shocking particularly that parents can sometimes be involved in pushing young people down that route as a way of ‘avoiding’ homosexuality.

rocketromano · 17/02/2019 22:30

Amazing that Gilligan has written this and that the Times have published - surely this will lead to changes esp to the affirmation model enforced onto clinicians at the moment

Manderleyagain · 18/02/2019 17:54

I wonder how the author of the report will respond to this weird deliberate confusion, in public, about his report?

Popchyk · 18/02/2019 18:09

Yes, looks like the Tavistock are ready to chuck David Bell under the bus. In stopping short from calling Gilligan a liar, they have cast aspersions on the veracity of Bell's report.

The report itself will clarify exactly who is lying.

And this part of their statement struck me.

"The recommendations made by Dr Sinha mainly focused on standardising and evidencing our very thoughtful and personalised processes in a field where clinicians grapple daily with high levels of complexity, sparse evidence and great variety in the young people coming forward, their developmental stage, feelings, histories and hopes".

I have a feeling that the public admission of sparse evidence will bite them in the arse in a courtroom very soon when these young people start legal action against the Tavi.

hipsterfun · 18/02/2019 18:33

Sparse evidence-based medicine. You heard it there first.

ChattyLion · 18/02/2019 19:26

Sparse evidence is absolutely not OK. If al you have is sparse evidence- fine then do some research first. or if it’s desperately urgent then proceed to do only the necessary minimum with very great caution and share your results of treatment with others openly. The opposite of what is happening here.

Could anyone who is out GC on Twitter very kindly please tweet some of these evidence based medicine gurus and tell them their ideas are outdated now and it’s fine to forge ahead to give permanent life limiting treatment based on ‘sparse evidence’ Hmm or Andrew Gilligan might want to ask them for comment:

www.bmj.com/campaign/ebm-history

R0wantrees · 24/02/2019 11:57

current thread discussing significant development, OP EweSurname wrote:
"Times article - Governor quits ‘blinkered’ Tavistock clinic
Another fantastic Giliigan piece

www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/governor-quits-blinkered-tavistock-clinic-82db7wzq8

A governor of the NHS trust that runs England’s only gender clinic for children has resigned in protest at its “blinkered” and “one-sided” response to doctors who had raised the alarm about “woefully inadequate” care.

Marcus Evans, a consultant psychotherapist at the Tavistock and Portman trust with three decades’ experience, told The Sunday Times that the trust had said things that were “not true”, had created a “climate of fear” and was trying to “dismiss or undermine” concerns raised by its own clinicians.

Some openly homophobic parents pushed their children to transition because they were gay, the report said. In other cases, youngsters seized on transition as a “solution” after abuse or bereavement. Their histories were not properly explored by clinicians struggling with “huge and unmanageable caseloads” and afraid of being accused of transphobia if they questioned the “rehearsed” surface presentation.

The report said Gids had tried to “placate” lobby groups such as the Mermaids charity, which campaigns for children to be given sex-change treatment."
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3515980-Times-article-Governor-quits-blinkered-Tavistock-clinic

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