Hi, I'm Liz the Glitch! Ask me anything.

[glitchliz]

The thread I wrote about attending Posie Parker's panel on gender identity and social media has attracted a lot of attention, and I thought it might be good to establish more of a dialogue. Ask me anything!

Also, to get this one out of the way: my babysitting rates are £15/hr, plus flights, and I'll provide a clean CRB check 😂

Glad Jonny Best was saying pretty much exactly the same as me around the same time on twitter (he says it better.)

Can't attach screen shot.

Replying to glinner:

"We don't make this point often enough. GC ppl are 100% inclusive of trans ppl: I'm male and embrace all trans women as part of the male class of ppl. I've yet to meet a radfem who doesn't include trans men in their feminism. What we won't do is allow males to define 'woman'."

Liz - "If you would prefer a male body, that's not unachievable. Just sayin'."

Still reading TFT but jesus, what actual planet are you living on?? You are literally making this up as you go along.

women murdered by their family in so called 'honour' killings,
children being subject to FGM,
young girls forced into marriage whilst still kids,
women beaten daily sometimes to death by their husband/partner.

These things happen to us because of our biology. I'm sure everyone of them would bloody love to achieve a male body to escape. BUT THEY CANT BECAUSE OF BIOLOGY.

I've stayed with this thread as long as I can.

Women are being told by OP to move out of their own movement.
We've also been told we can make another movement for just ourselves that wont be appropriated.

Thats big of you, but no thanks. You should make your own movement, like we had to.

The ease with which everything women have worked for, fought for and paid for has been taken from us should be a lesson to all trans activists.

In Canada, in the debate over the passage of Bill C-16, when Meghan Murphy was testifying, one of the legislators actually suggested to her that if she was not happy with the condition of being female in a male-dominated society, the solution was for her to transition to male.

”I want you and your trans siblings to have a seat at the table. But YOUR OWN seat, not to take the one (and it usually is still just one) that women better and braver than me fought so hard and so long for. We still need it.”

This is just perfect.

If only TRAs would accept it.

Wow, this went off over night. I’m only on page 11 and it’s entirely as predicted: completely inability to answer perfectly logical questions. Before I read the renaming 20 pages, can anyone tell me if it gets better?

I’m still pages behind (been doing all that unpaid work that still largely falls to women and that transwomen never seem so keen to to identify into-y’know cooking, cleaning, putting the kids to bed?) but all this “sure, I’m totally fine with being excluded blah blah stuff” reminds me of the segment from the TRA handbook about making sure to present some apparently rational, reasonable faces to the general public to help them buy into the trans narrative. Or is that just me?

No, it's not just you.

I think we’ve given this person way too much attention already - and that’s what 90% of transbollocks is about.

And cue the disingenuous whinging on twitter. Not quite sure this was in good faith.

It's informative to read their daft views of MN - did you know that if your post doesn't attack 3 TAs then MNHQ remove it?

So, honest as well as reasonable, eh?

(For lurking American TRAs, this is what the Brits call "sarcasm".)

My first question is about the Baseball Bats of Empowerment. Now, Liz said that these were seen as symbols of empowerment for transwomen and not as weapons. However, imagery that makes it clear that they're seen by some trans activists as weapons is all over Twitter and Tumblr. The ones wrapped in barbed wire are a particularly odd choice if the aim is empowerment rather than violent intimidation. So, Liz, please explain how wrapping your bat in barbed wire serves to make it more empowering in a non-violent way? Also, post you made referred people to the Degenderettes to buy their own bat (bit lazy, that, painting isn't hard). Do you think the exhibit about that group that the library in San Francisco put on comes across as empowering in a non-threatening way? Including the display that featured a tshirt daubed in something meant to look like blood that suggested the wearer physically attacks "TERFS"? (There were photos posted here, so no point trying to deny that it existed.)

We await the responses with baited breath! I'm particularly interested to see how all of that could be perceived as demonstrating less potential for violence than a group of women sitting around in a conference room or lecture hall having a meeting.

#ManFriday Art Gallery is worth a second visit. It was curated last May and includes photographs of transpeople posing with baseball bats etc

concluding observation,
"I have more but I think that’s enough for you to get the gist. Are you as sickened, as scared, as angry, as I am?

The women and transwomen being attacked by these male ‘trans rights activists’ have rather different weapons of choice:

Public debates open to all
Swimming trunks and a ridiculous hat
T-shirts, badges and leaflets
Silly cartoons
A crowd-funded legal challenge to a political party breaking the law
Meetings with our MPs
Media interviews
Discussion on a public forum
A petition on the government website" (continues)

manfridayuk.org/2018/05/04/manfriday-the-11th-our-very-own-art-exhibition/

I’m surprised by Liz’s take on Twitter post-thread.

Disappointed actually.

Oh god this is so depressing. It is impossible to engage with someone who abandons rationality so completely. I’m not sure if Liz really believes that biology is not real, or is just pretending, or which is worse: delusion or lies. And the stuff about the baseball bat....

I would love to believe it is possible to have a rational discussion, but based on what we’ve seen from Liz here, it isn’t.
Sex is immutable.
Men can’t become women.
Rachel Dolezal is white.
Women don’t want men in their spaces and sports.
And a man who pretends otherwise is - well, I think a man who pretends otherwise is at best unhappy and disturbed, and at worst deeply frightening and malevolent.
Abandoning logic and reason, denying material reality, is the beginning of extremism. It doesn’t bode well. What a frightening world for our daughters to inherit.

Well. That was disheartening.

Can you imagine if women took baseball bats wrapped in barbed wire to their meetings? They would call the cops on them.

And rightly so, because anyone carrying around a bat covered in barbed wire is making it clear that they intend to harm anyone who looks at them sideways.

What was said on Twitter about this thread? Have I missed it?

And rightly so, because anyone carrying around a bat covered in barbed wire is making it clear that they intend to harm anyone who looks at them sideway

but but but, it is empowering.

Aye right.

Last year there was a narrative created and spread by some UK male Twitter TRAs that women going to WPUK/We Need to Talk meetings were taking baseball bats to harm transpeople.
The basis was a single twitter comment which did not describe intention or that women were dong such a thing.

Calvinsmam ‘dozens of questions’ about Liz’s underwear and elements of this thread Liz felt were disrespectful.

Here’s another empowering image. He’s not a violent thug of course, he’s just proud of being white.

Someone being unwilling toengage and being unwilling to budge is one thing, the problem appears to be with quite a lot of these activists no ability to, no insight into their behaviour ergo no capacity for change, and they have been validated by major institutions in irational beliefs that women's very existing and systems protecting from violence are an existential threat to them. They have nothing when you argue with them. As someone else said earlier beyond 'because I say so and I experience it as great pain when I am reminded that isnt true'. This is really dangerous. This is mad as fuck. This is women across national borders, being set against people who dont have anything beyond 'because I said so' whose disordered thinking has been validated by just aout every elite institution. They genuinely believe I think that when we discuss this context they hadnt been able to consider that we are a threat to them and that seems to me to be best taken at face value. But wow.

A bat. A bloody bat. A fucking bat in a conversation about safeguarding and protection from abuse and violence? You take that at face fucking value, assess if there is any insight into it and you take that at face value. You cant debate that. And yet this is what we are being asked to do. 'Radicl feminism excluding trans people'. This is an argument iover media feminism which has done enough damage. A delusion that you could do this via the medium of cosmo pages of the political press.

An argument over safeguarding and equaity legislation with the stakeholders in that argument? IE people protected by law on the basis of vulnerability? Presented as a political argument via elite academia and media on those stakeholders cos feminism.
And major institutions have validated activists who think a bat is a valid political expression or symbolism in a conversation with those stakeholders.