Hi, I'm Liz the Glitch! Ask me anything.

[glitchliz]

The thread I wrote about attending Posie Parker's panel on gender identity and social media has attracted a lot of attention, and I thought it might be good to establish more of a dialogue. Ask me anything!

Also, to get this one out of the way: my babysitting rates are £15/hr, plus flights, and I'll provide a clean CRB check 😂

I think people have been unfair to MN on this thread as the OP is a GF.

So are about 70% of other posters on Mumsnet, goady fuckery if done right is fine.

As it stands this thread is going to attach people, people will read it.

It's all good.

OP, you write Bodily autonomy is something I feel very strongly about. Then why can't you accept the bodily autonomy of women saying they want "woman" to be restricted to those who actually are women so we can avoid having someone who is autogynephiliac with a full functioning penis in our changing rooms? How about our bodily autonomy to only engage in consensual sexual activity? If/when a autogynephiliac enters a women's changing room it is because they get sexually aroused by it and any woman inside is an unwilling participant in the autogynephiliacs sexual fantasy.

And you saying that posing with the bat was not meant to be threatening? Yeah, that is you calling us all stupid. Real women are used to threats of male violence and we are quite capable of recognising a threat, thank you very much. How about you apologize for the threat instead and remove the offensive photo from your twitter? (or wherever else you have posted it).

Do you think it is possible for a person to be born with no gender identity whatsoever who just perceives themself to be their consciousness +personality occupying their body?

Some people identify as agender, yes. I can't speak as to their experiences but that sounds about right. I personally would consider that a non-binary identity, but as I said earlier, I'm not the gender sheriff and I'm not a representative of anyone but myself.

Hey @ClappyMonkey on Twitter, if you're still reading this... you do know the bats have nothing to do with baseball, right? You know TRAs parade with them as weapons to use against feminists?

twitter.com/clappymonkey/status/1090616482894098432?s=19

If someone self-IDs as transgender but doesn't have gender dysphoria, what is the non-dysphoric motivation for the transition beyond choosing to do so?

I will be surprised (& impressed) if Liz addresses the issue of severing the link between women/females being of the class that produces ova and changing it to anyone who says so. And why this bothers women (not all women. But a lot)

glitchliz

Can you answer my question above? And I think BowlofBabelFish made a similar point.

I'll reiterate:

You said:

There are two types of human gametes, spermatazoa and ova. Some people produce one, some produce the other, other people produce neither. Some people have a delivery mechanism for spermatazoa, and other people have uteruses, which can be used to gestate a fertilised ovum into a fetus and eventually a person.

I replied

"And the words for those would be male and female or man and woman."

"So what is your definition of woman or female if not people have uteruses, which can be used to gestate a fertilised ovum into a fetus and eventually a person."

"What is your definition? What is the definition of people who include the above description, and transwomen, but exclude men."

Ok I have one question. A two-parter.

1. do you identify as a woman because you feel your body is wrong, and if so...

2. isn't that acknowledging that the definition of female is ultimately biological?

CharlyAngelic don't go! This board is quite intimidating and I very rarely post on it but this thread feels more approachable than others. You made a mistake but your opinions and voice are as important as every other woman's on this topic. It doesn't serve anybody to shut women out of this debate. Nothing wrong with pointing out slips in comprehension in a polite way to help someone understand a point, but it shouldn't be done in a way that's likely to discourage that woman from being part of the conversation because we need female voices to be heard.

In the statement "born of the sex class who gestate the young", it's the "class" bit that is an important distinction to make. Someone can be infertile, childless etc but still be "born of the sex class who gestate the young". It's important because the trans lobby will quite often use the argument that some born females haven't had children/are infertile and so what's the difference between them and a transwoman.

If someone self-IDs as transgender but doesn't have gender dysphoria, what is the non-dysphoric motivation for the transition beyond choosing to do so?

In the same way that some people have gender dysphoria, some people have gender euphoria - like, they feel happier living and presenting as another gender. Some people just choose to for whatever reason they want to - and that's fine. I agree that if someone decided to transition to attack others, that would be reprehensible - however, to be perfectly clear an unambiguous, that is not a real problem because nobody needs to transition to be violent to women. We barely punish men for rape or sexual assault or domestic violence - transitioning does not facilitate that in the slightest, and just makes the rest of your life more difficult. Having been made to perform a gender that wasn't mine, I know just how infeasible it is to keep up appearances.

why would making things easier to change your details affect whether or not your GP, which for dysphoric people should be involved at the beginning of the process, refers you for mental health services?

Because if healthcare services are not seen as necessary the government will do away with them and they won’t be available to anyone anymore. So it’s a win for them.
Decent healthcare needs to be fought for. Especially decent mental health care. It’s vital for children and it’s simply non-existent.

And it won’t be available at all if you don’t fight for it and protect it.

Having been made to perform a gender that wasn't mine, I know just how infeasible it is to keep up appearances.

You haven't answered the question about sex and gender. What is the difference?

I wonder if you've seen the thread on Marilyn?

Are you from the UK Liz?
The NHS will remove help for people at the slightest excuse.

80s pop star Marilyn thinks there’s only two sexes www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3493718-80s-pop-star-Marilyn-thinks-there-s-only-two-sexes

Having been made to perform a gender that wasn't mine, I know just how infeasible it is to keep up appearances

Holding a baseball bat inferring you will use it against women, is not the sort of thing women usually do. What made you decide to take this photo and publish it on social media.

But women only spaces, whereby the convention is that men who enter are treated suspiciously/asked to leave reduces the risk to women. Removing this convention - anyone is a women, don’t challenge men in women’s spaces, this increases risk to women.

No one needs to transition or even pretend to transition to attack women. But for fucks sake why should we make it easier?

Do you really not see that?

In the same way that some people have gender dysphoria, some people have gender euphoria - like, they feel happier living and presenting as another gender.

In which case don't confuse it with living as another sex.

You can't change sex. You can wear what you like. And be as euphoric about it as you want.

Gender however is different. Gender roles, for women, are typically to do with the fact that they are seen as lesser than. So they are paid less, expected to do emotional, domestic and sexual labour for nothing, their opinions are not as important as those of men, and their bodies are the property of men and something that can be bought, etc.

It's pretty grim if you think men want to adopt those things as they find it euphoric.

some people have gender euphoria

This sounds like Autogynephilia? If not how is it different?

@glitchz I went to click on your profile and have been blocked. Despite never having any correspondence with you.

Do you use TERFblocker and if so, why? Personally I have never blocked anyone on Twitter as I like to see all people's points of view, however have been blocked by many TRAs who I have never spoken to. It doesn't make any sense.

What is the minimum involved in transition to become a transwoman? Is just thinking "I have a female gender identity" solely to oneself and never mentioning it to anyone and not making any change in presentation, behaviour, habits, etc sufficient to have transitioned to become a transwoman?

@CharlyAngelic

I have never gestated young and I probably never will, however I am of the sex class of human that do and am treated as such by society.
The perceived potential of your sexed body by society effects you no matter whether you can, or do actually gestate.

I know it's a bit rude but I'm going to repeat my question because I'dd really like to know the answer Liz

How do you know you're a woman?

What characteristics do you and I share that makes us both women, that we don't share with Tom Hanks, because he's a man?

I'm not the gender sheriff and I'm not a representative of anyone but myself.

In that case, do you listen to women who reject the label 'Cis'? I have seen many trans people and their allies very insistent on respecting identities and using preferred pronouns yet telling women that they have to accept this descriptor.

What characteristics do you and I share that makes us both women, that we don't share with Tom Hanks, because he's a man?

Yep. Quite a lot of us are asking the same question. For an ask me anything, it's being studiously ignored.