A reminder: What we did was brilliant. Is brilliant.

[lisamuggeridge]

What we did was amazing. We pulled the GUardian, Parliament, the House of Lords, the media, out of a position they were determined to have, we changed the debate, we showed women were a political force, we acted, all over the country we acted. In different ways. We were bound by the GRA review and as soon as that was done it was evident that power relations had recreated within a social movement. Yes some people by reflex did things that they would always have done. Now we get to relearn and renegotiate power relations by saying we dont play the way media tribalists did. Whatever fall outs there have been were always going to hapen but we still did that. Thats why htis board is permanently monitored by nutcases and acually the power we demonstrated is directly at the root of the toxic fallouts and is a mark of success in itself. Political spectrum reforming within this movement is alright, but it probably pays to remember how amazing what we achieved was and letting that guide what we can achieve., We changed the conversation we can keep doing that. Easily. By having the conversation we want and not bowing to social media tribalism that hides all sorts of nasties and existing political orgs. And learning in a way they cant.

It was DanceLikeEmmaGoldman at 0:08 on this thread I think Woman

I thought it was a fantastic comment too

I do recall that comment woman. I think it was on the Jean Hatchett blog post thread, but could be wrong. I liked it too.

I thought that would be logically where it would be but can't find it :(

I love DanceLikeEmmaGoldman 's posts. I think she is very wise

but then I'm baffled by crochet waistcoats, so what do I know?

a low point, but a real turning point was the footage from the Jam Jar event. the amazing and ever courageous Julie Bindel

the shock of seeing masked men intimidating women trying to attend a meeting was what got me off my arse and attending women's place meetings, and then canvassing in the street.

It's been quite a year, hasn't it?

This one @womanformallyknownaswoman ?

Heroism and adulation of heroes is a very male trait. The idea that somebody could embody perfection is a nonsense.

We are all human. Women surely must recognise that humans, no matter their ideals, are fallible. We all lose our temper, tell fibs, behave less than honourably, have feeble moments and get swept up in social media outrage. And a million other failings inherent to being human.

Someone can be brave, brilliant and amazing and also be rude, selfish and impatient. Someone can be strong, innovative and creative, while also being unreliable, thoughtless and paranoid.

Instead of expecting the world of the women we admire, and feeling betrayed when they reveal their flawed humanity, we should admire the good stuff, recognise the not-so-good stuff and understand that everyone has feet of clay.

Every women who, at the end of their tether, yelled at a child or bitched about a partner or snapped at a sales clerk recognises that sometimes good people are bad. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t call them out when necessary, but that shouldn’t happen just because they have exposed their failings and we’re outraged at their fall from grace.

Would we even be having these conversations if the people we are talking about were male? I don’t think so - we’d excuse their bad behaviour because of their achievements.

The whole point of female socialisation is to force us to focus inwards on our appearance and our behaviour. And it sets up other women as the arbiters, which is why women can be so vicious to each other - it’s built into the system. FGM is performed on women, by women, at the behest of the patriarchy.

It’s hard to read the label from inside the bottle, but we really need to resist our socialisation. It stops us being properly angry and makes us turn on each other.

Its PA

It was DanceLikeEmmaGoldman at 0:08 on this thread I think Woman

I thought it was a fantastic comment too

Thx Bernard - that's it - phew...
I'll repeat it here as I too think it's fantastic:

DancelikeEmmaGoldman Tue 29-Jan-19 00:08:56
I do not expect feminists to do things perfectly.

I think this is an important point, weriseup.

Heroism and adulation of heroes is a very male trait. The idea that somebody could embody perfection is a nonsense.

We are all human. Women surely must recognise that humans, no matter their ideals, are fallible. We all lose our temper, tell fibs, behave less than honourably, have feeble moments and get swept up in social media outrage. And a million other failings inherent to being human.

Someone can be brave, brilliant and amazing and also be rude, selfish and impatient. Someone can be strong, innovative and creative, while also being unreliable, thoughtless and paranoid.

Instead of expecting the world of the women we admire, and feeling betrayed when they reveal their flawed humanity, we should admire the good stuff, recognise the not-so-good stuff and understand that everyone has feet of clay.

Every women who, at the end of their tether, yelled at a child or bitched about a partner or snapped at a sales clerk recognises that sometimes good people are bad. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t call them out when necessary, but that shouldn’t happen just because they have exposed their failings and we’re outraged at their fall from grace.

Would we even be having these conversations if the people we are talking about were male? I don’t think so - we’d excuse their bad behaviour because of their achievements.

The whole point of female socialisation is to force us to focus inwards on our appearance and our behaviour. And it sets up other women as the arbiters, which is why women can be so vicious to each other - it’s built into the system. FGM is performed on women, by women, at the behest of the patriarchy.

It’s hard to read the label from inside the bottle, but we really need to resist our socialisation. It stops us being properly angry and makes us turn on each other.

oh cross post - yes that's the one Bernard
thx appreciate you recalling

the shock of seeing masked men intimidating women trying to attend a meeting

Yes, it really was unbelievable. Imagine if women did that to TRA’s. Everyone would be talking about it. It’s just astounding what is going on.

⭐️⭐️

Yes! Man Friday definitely deserve a special mention here.

What they did was AMAZING. Brought it into the mainstream like nothing else.

And the unforgettable Stickerwoman. She really got around

I’m really disappointed with Man Friday, in that photo.

She should have matched that towel with her lovely hat. 😁

What’s passive aggressive? What did I miss?

I came here to celebrate! 🍾🎶📣🎼☕🤗

I saw the title, and was agreed, this is something to celebrate!!! It was very clear and unambiguous.

I am utterly convinced that most men and most women support safe spaces and clarity in law for women and children for their ongoing protection from abuses.

Never again should a terrified child and mother in refuge hiding from abuse have to hear the voice of a male, penis bearer within its supposedly safe confines. Tell me, have they not suffered enough?!!

Yes, they have, and it has to stop, and I couldn't give an arsehole who amongst us is celebrating this today, so long as they are celebrating, right? How could anyone not celebrate🤔

I fail to understand anyone finding a reason to put a stop to such a vital, and simple truth, being celebrated. Women are women, simples. TWANot Women.

As for calling women 'cow' sacred or otherwise, along with other attacks, is trying to despoil and derail, and is refusing to see the bigger picture.

This is a bigger picture thread, bigger than any of that noise, this is a about celebrating women being women, and standing up against erasure.

Anyone who loves women and children will stand up for that right.

...and just because you say its done politely, doesn't mean it is.

PERF saying its done politely bit like saying with respect, fuck u its not respectful, and an oxymoron

I’m really disappointed with Man Friday, in that photo.
She should have matched that towel with her lovely hat

Tch, tch, misgendering Man Friday - blokes don't usually do matchy-matchy.
(Autocorrect tried to turn that into matcha...)

PERF saying its done politely bit like saying with respect, fuck u its not respectful, and an oxymoron

Ah right. I get you now. I love that previous post, bty. 👏🏼

Tch, tch, misgendering Man Fridayshock - blokes don't usually do matchy-matchy

Awaiting deletion post from MNHQ. 😳

Who are you including in the 'we'? Are you in the 'we'? Curious

Let's hear it for Jean.

geeewhizz Tue 29-Jan-19 13:30:14
Interesting you should post that, R0wantrees. So your dad was persuaded at least partly by the work of a journalist who is simultaneously being trashed by the OP right now and who has posted about the damage done to her reputation and therefore the work she is able to do because of OP never mind the distress she has endured. I'd say there's a conflict in your position.

Oh I missed this.

Its an interesting comment presumably about Joani Walsh who co-wrote recent articles in the Telegraph and Daily Mail about NHS policy?

As I said, my Dad was peaked by Bex Stinson on Woman's Hour.
He doesn't read either of the papers that Joani Walsh wrote for.
They are good articles.

Regular posters been talking about the sex/gender issue in the NHS for a long time on FWR prior to those articles though. I had a quite a bit of information to share with him when we met up before Christmas including the work by Anne Harper Wright and copies of some of the NHS single sex accomodation /transgender policies.

Anne Harper-Wright published really good articles with great detail back in October 2018 'Sex, Gender & the NHS' I think she's been working on this for some time.
discussed here
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3396859-Weve-been-lied-to-about-Single-SEX-wards-since-2010

I remember discussing the crazy Gillick competency issue clause on a thead back in September on here. I'd been staying with a friend who's a nurse and I'd been looking at some single-sex accomodation policies. I may try and find it at some point

I don't think Joani Walsh completely grasped the full issues but why would she without working knowledge of Safeguarding. They were well written articles.

It's so importnat though to get this information out there.
I know many women have been working really hard to gather information, collate it and try to find a way of making it public.

geeewhizz Its an odd accusation to level at me that there's 'conflict in my position' I'm not sure which position you are claiming I occupy but from the contributions you've made on this thread, I'm not inclined to pay much heed to it & doubt its accurate.

You're clearly concerned for 'the journalist' though.

Oh look! Another new poster. There’s a surprise. 😒

I guess now we know where all those socks that get lost in the dryer end up.