Courting the far right is wrong....

[OneTimeThing]

...if you follow that with a ‘but’ to justify Posie Parker’s courting of the far right, then you are a fascist.

I said I would only post one thing on this board. I kept that promise.

But this is the pits right here. Posie Parker is seeking funding and making deals with white supremacist, crypto fascists, misogynists, homophobes and racists. How does this not show you what your movement is and has always been?

You need to look at yourselves. If your response is anything other than total rejection of posie Parker and all the groups she is involving herself with, then you are just as bad. If you think that trans people/‘trans activists’ are worse than Tommy Robinson, ultra trump supporters and others who spew far right views then you are a racist, sexist, homophobic nightmare. Those labels equally describe what a person is as well as what a person does.

“But what about TRA’s?” Some of you will want to scream at me.

You don’t see Paris Lees going off to get funding from literal fascists. Hell, Caitlin Jenner votes for trump and the global trans community has never and will never forgive her. And either way, none of what “they” do will magically make it okay to go suck up to people that think gay people should be sterilised or that Muslim’s are evil.

Transphobia is revolting. It’s wrong, and it comes as no surprise to hear that transphobia (which most of you peddle right here) will eventually push people towards other kinds of hate.

Take a long hard look at yourselves. I’m a transgender woman, a mum, and I hope at least some of you are seriously thinking about what kind of person you want to be.

You just read what you want to read, to suit your view and what fits nicely into your little box.

And yet, it appears to be you that won't allow some women an opinion on matters that you do not want them to talk about. Strange that.

Devout conservative Christians will not want trans people to be accepted at all because they are not ‘as god made us’ or whatever.
I've seen arguments that they prefer trans to gay, as one is an "illness" and the other is just unacceptable behaviour.
The "all made in God's image" argument would mean they'd have to be against plastic surgery in general; I've not seen that. But it'd be interesting to see some links on what they do think.

Sorry EarlyWalker - you don't get to rewrite the whole thread to suit your agenda.
The opening post was a spittle flecked rant about "supremacist, crypto fascists, misogynists, homophobes and racists" and targeting one woman by name. It was attempting to blame, shame and silence women.
There are legitimate issues to discuss about allegiances and individual women will quite rightly wish to set their personal boundaries where they choose. The modus operandi of this OP and TRAs generally is to instruct, demand, bully and hector women into speaking and behaving as they see fit. We see it repeatedly - instructions not to discuss our bodies, our language, our meetings policed, being told to rename our bodies, and all aspects of our lives now defined as transphobic. This thread was a repeat of these tactics - but it no longer works.
We see you all..

The point of the thread was (in a less goady nutshell ‘is feminism moving to the far right’

You missed the bit 'posed by someone born with a penis'.

That bit is important. It begs the question 'Why the fuck does op feel entitled to shepherd feminism's direction, since feminism in neither for or about them?'.

It's been an interesting thread. For reasons I can't quite get my head around at the moment, it's been one of the best epic fails of gender identity ideology I've seen on here.

It's something to do with the raging authoritarianism but I'm sure there's additional stuff too. I'll have to sit for a while and have a ponder.

You just read what you want to read, to suit your view and what fits nicely into your little box. The point of the thread was (in a less goady nutshell ‘is feminism moving to the far right’ I’m saying my POV as to why it might be and why I think it may not be a good thing. It’s easier for you to all just start wondering off topic than actually have a civil debate.

QED. You just cannot see it, can you? You're arguing with what you think is a mirror of your own catechism - but it doesn't exist. You're not arguing with a catechism here: you're arguing with dozens of different women with varying views on this thread, none of whom are following a catechism other than women have voices and can use them in any way they see fit.

nauticant
You mustn't be friends with her because if you are you can't be friends with me

Meanwhile, the grownups will be discussing more important issues like safeguarding children and protecting safe spaces for women and girls.

I've seen arguments that they prefer trans to gay, as one is an "illness" and the other is just unacceptable behaviour
The "all made in God's image" argument would mean they'd have to be against plastic surgery in general; I've not seen that. But it'd be interesting to see some links on what they do think.

I've seen both. Funnily enough it seems that conservative Christians aren't a homogeneous blob either...

The thread is regarding Posie, if you don’t want to discuss it why are you here?

Come for the recipes, stay for the jokes. I bloody love women being funny and taking the piss.

Also, if women want to campaign on anti-abortion, I’m fine with that. I don’t agree with them, but I don’t run the world (yet. Next Tuesday’s meeting should set a schedule for going forward and I expect we’ll have a firm date to begin testing the implementation schedule by May. Then watch out.)

The point of the thread was (in a less goady nutshell ‘is feminism moving to the far right’

Was it? Didn't look like it to me. Looked more like a male trying to tell women they were thinking WrongThink.

WeRiseUp
I think you are right, people do feel they have to "shepherd" us.

Funnily enough it seems that conservative Christians aren't a homogeneous blob either...
Good point

(I know the thread has moved on but...)

earlywalker

You should care because if you want to be heard, you need people to want to listen.

You think a feminist that’s just entered the GC world is going to want to get on board with anti abortion protestors? You think anyone is going to believe it’s all in the name of woman when you don’t condem people like that?

Yeah, we've heard it all before. Greatest trick the patriarchy ever pulled was convincing us that if we were just nice enough then the men would listen.

Damn frickin right I'll listen to women who are anti abortion protesters, feminism = female liberation. How can I ask them to listen to me if I don't respect them enough to listen to them? I'll listen to women, always.

Maybe we need t-shirts with bigotry
/ˈbɪɡətri/
noun
intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself.

If the TRAs has started campaigning for anti-abortions, or aligned themselves with religious organisations.. you’d be discussing it. Because it’s ‘your own’ you’ll ignore it, in favour of oh so hillarious recipe sharing.

I used to enjoy the debate on mumsnet, different views all being shared in a respectful way. Now it’s so strange, like youre so paranoid it’s an attack on your rights or a TRA infiltration you won’t discuss anything.
It’s a shame really. I get lots of PM’s, but no one will join in as it’s so hostile.
Differences of opinion enrich and educate people, you shouldn’t be scared to engage in it.

AngryAttackKittens

"Just entered the GC world" sounds so dramatic, like you go through a wardrobe and then when you step out the other side Mr Tumnus misgenders you.

Mr McAvoy can call me whatever he likes...

Earlywalker
It’s easier for you to all just start wondering off topic than actually have a civil debate

Easier? Oh I don't know, we've been here all day.

Just wanted to add, anti-abortions and anti-contraceptives are most definitely a feminist issue. The fact no one has condemned it, on a forum specifically to discuss woman’s rights is very interesting.

Earlywalker
Differences of opinion enrich and educate people, you shouldn’t be scared to engage in it.

Do you even hear yourself?

differences of opinion enrich and educate people, you shouldn’t be scared to engage in it

And in yet another strange [predictable] twist, it was you saying only the women that agree with you are allowed an opinion on abortion.

You just cannot see it can you?

Oh it’s a visit from the women’s comment police 👮‍♀️ force again

With a warning ⚠️

That has no legal standing - where have I come across this before???

Differences of opinion enrich and educate people, you shouldn’t be scared to engage in it.

The irony on the thread just got so dense it has it's own gravitational pull.

Devout conservative Christians will not want trans people to be accepted at all because they are not ‘as god made us’ or whatever. Feminists do not (should not?) want trans people to not be accepted, they would call for acceptance of them for who they are but do not want them to be seen as their preferred sex in spaces where sex segregation is necessary.

What hands across the aisle say about this is:
As the Hands Across the Aisle Coalition, we are committed to working together, rising above our differences, and leveraging our collective resources to oppose gender identity ideology.

That is what we have in common - the agreement that gender identity ideology is the problem. The problem is the idea that your preferences for certain clothing or interests is anything to do with 'gender'. The idea that you can have a ladybrain in a male body. The idea that feelings about your 'gender' should override the material reality of your sex.

you won’t discuss anything

And yet we’ve been discussing this all flipping night. Including plenty responding directly to your strange points. Yet again, the problem is you haven’t got the response you want, we won’t agree with your generalisations or desire to silence women who disagree on abortion, so you keep repeating the nonsense that we won’t debate or engage. You’ve just gone on and on repeating the same thing and going over points already made and responded to. You’ve absolutely been engaged with, stop saying you haven’t. We don’t all agree with you. Deal with it.

If we aren't allowed a list of things we arent allowed to talk about then I am fucked if I am going to subscribe to an enforced list of things I am told to condemn.

And I do enjoy being told what I, as someone who probably qualifies as a 'conservative Christian' actually think. It's always so bloody far from bang on.