Will society accept transwomen ARE women in future generations?

[interestingdebatetoday]

Today I debated with a young woman I adore. I'm in my 30's, her in her 20's. She attended uni in a very liberal city and has studied psychology. Definitely armed to hold an opinion.

We disagree currently on several of the current topics re trans. I personally hold what's probably the norm on the feminist boards of mumsnet in my views.

It made me wonder though - she claims not to feel women are really impacted, uses unisex bathrooms as a norm, and obviously has been socialised to not find an issue in accepting transwomen as women. Is it possible that actually society will progress in a way that her generation down simply won't have the issues which I feel exist when trying to include transwomen AS women?

Can women be educated/socialised to a place over time where several generations on - we will be the old women with outdated beliefs and the world simply isn't bothered about the things which we were?

It has to go one way or the other really doesn't it? Either a big u turn and the idea that transwomen ARE women becomes laughable and delusional is mainstream and acceptable (as many of us might feel on the boards) OR transwomen ARE women and we were the ones who were wrong

It made me wonder... I was really suprised tbh. 10 years later made a huge difference to whether we felt our rights were under attack...

One last, weet.

You're coming across as not terribly bright is not an attack on your intelligence, it's an attack on your style.

I never assume people are not smart based on what they post. Some just don't write well. Others, well, there's willful ignorance, isn't there?

I agree with others. Ignore.

I am not. I am expressing my opinion

No, there's more going on than that.

Oh ok. That makes it all fine then. Thanks for explaining it to me.

So the majority consensus is... it's possible or it's impossible for future generations to accept TWAW?

I will RTFT but it will take me a while and probably move on while I do 😅

No, there's more going on than that.

Oh please enlighten me.

Jeez weet give over
Ffs you go on and on yet say nowt
Dull as fuck

calvin

I like that plan, makes more sense to me

So with regards the definition that a woman is someone with breasts, I'll repost an earlier comment I made:

Taking cross-sex hormones causes side-effects.

I met a lovely older man recently who talked about his successful treatment for cancer which involved being given a form of oestrogen.

It had been really successful and he was living well and cancer free.
He described some of the side effects, including 'little man boobs' as he called them.
He had taken this in his stride.
He's still as male a man.
Just as masculine as he was before.

When I had a total hysterectomy (for medical neccesity) in my 30's, I had immediate surgical menopause.
There were some side effects due to the drastic hormone profile change.
I'm just as female a woman
Im just as feminine as I was before.

I have female friends who as a consequence of gyny cancer have also had elective mastectomies (due to BRCA+)
Like me they have no uterus, cervix, fallopian tubes or ovaries.
They are just as female women
They are just as feminine as they were before.

Once more for the cheap seats in the back,

Here’s the study for the one in ten statistic

jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/2375127

r0wan

I think maybe feminist realises it wasnt the gotcha moment they thought it was and is now lying low

In the hooe that it will be forgotten

No need for cheap,seats they all left cos wheet bored them rigid

So the majority consensus is... it's possible or it's impossible for future generations to accept TWAW?

I think most agree that people will always know the difference between the sexes, whatever they are called.

Unless in the future, there'll only be robots. But robots don't care about humans, so they won't know even the word "transwoman" and as such can't think that transwomen are women.

I vote: Impossible.

R0wantrees

At the risk of being accused of all sorts

• the treatments used for prostate cancer aren't actually female hormones, they are androgen blockers. An alternative is orchidectomy.

So it's actually that the male hormones are blocked, rather than female hormones are given.

Learned experience from many years as a nurse on a urology ward.

Oi oi wheet ?

I met a lovely older man recently who talked about his successful treatment for cancer which involved being given a form of oestrogen.

It had been really successful and he was living well and cancer free.
He described some of the side effects, including 'little man boobs' as he called them.
He had taken this in his stride.

Weetabixandshreddies

Your arogance and inability to listen to what people have to say is breathtaking and frankly shocking given your apparent nursing career.

I have reported a conversation with a man I met.
He didn't tell me the type of cancer he had.
I didn't ask.
But I did listen, carefully.

Just as I have to your many recent posts on a number of threads.

Fair play R0wantrees

Never heard of cancer being treated with female hormones. I shall go and read up on that.

Ffs weet guys with prostate cancer get oestrogen this is no5 new stuff
Fair play patronising much idiot

Though having just looked it up from research at the the National Cancer Institute it is what I said - not female hormones but androgen blockers, because female hormones aren't given in men to treat cancer.

So if you cultivate your man boobs in a particular way (by taking female hormones rather than androgen blockers) that makes you a woman? Is that like organic farming?

Also it’s hilarious that you are correctly identifying the female hormones. Almost like you know exactly what a female is!

Ffs weet guys with prostate cancer get oestrogen this is no5 new stuff

Since when? They get Zoladex or prostap which are androgen blockers.

Still haven’t looked at the study showing one in ten then Wheet?

jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/2375127

Hormone Therapy for Prostate Cancer. Hormone therapy is also called androgen deprivation therapy (ADT) or androgen suppression therapy. The goal is to reduce levels of male hormones, called androgens, in the body, or to stop them from affecting prostate cancer cells. Androgens stimulate prostate cancer cells to grow.18 Jul 2018