Sally Hines accuses Professor Rosa Freedman of being mean on Twitter

[OrchidInTheSun]

Hines says she's copied in her university and the ESRC into tweets about her. She's very cross. So cross that she can't spell Rosa's name properly - it's Freedman, not Freeman.

Here's her tirade
threadreaderapp.com/thread/1066446520575250435.html

Yes I think you're right GCAcademic. It's a bit silly for Sally to just make stuff up though. Still, I guess that she has form

What a weird thing to say. Prof Sally Hines certainly has published in this REF period. You're not gonna like it though

Spanna, if you think Professor Freedman is 'appallingly unprofessional', do you think the same about Adrian Harrop, Sally Hines herself, the 'lawyer' suing Graham Linehan?

Look them up on their uni web pages. It shows all their publications. They're both professors. It takes loads of time, work and effort to become a professor.

Becoming a professor, publishing and getting grants all require multiple peer reviews by equally qualified people.

Freedman's extensive research is about international human rights law. Hines's extensive research is on gender and sexuality. That's why Hines got two ESRC grants on this topic, and Freedman didn't (and likely wouldnt have bothered applying as she'll know her publications and expertise are in the wrong area).

The hubris of calling Hines's qualifications into question here is just embarrassing.

Not everything published would be put in the REF. Esp at a Uni like Leeds. If thr journal isn't highly ranked then that article might not be submitted.

Hines has relatively few publications for a senior academic. Two articles on her website are listed twice.

ego sentio ergo sum

Genius

Not everything published would be put in the REF. Esp at a Uni like Leeds. If thr journal isn't highly ranked then that article might not be submitted.

Quite. And, as I'm sure spanna is entirely aware, Rosa suggested that Sally Hines hadn't published anything REF-able in this period, not that she hadn't published anything at all.

Smoke: meet mirror.

And there they go again with the lies. That's why we laugh at people like Hines and our resident TRAs - they have to lie (Deceive, Inveigle Obfuscate 😉) to be heard. No-one really takes them seriously.

I think Sally should come on here answer questions. We all know that it can be hard to perform well in a live radio interview, especially if the questions are difficult. If Sally believes she was unfairly treated, this would be an opportunity for her to set the record straight, giving her time to think of her answers first.

How would Freedman know if Hines's articles are REFable? She's in a totally different discipline.

How do you know?

... and this isn't a place I'd advise anyone to come for a reasonable conversation. SH has been roundly abused on here. Why on earth would she come in for a cosy chat?

What bowlofbabelfish said, as always.

Also, did anyone else read the last line as quite threatening?
Professor Rosa Freeman, I hope your institution has your back as Leeds has mine.

And yes to an AMA with Sally Hines. You could bill it as an academic trying to engage the "ignorant" public, or something. Although I suspect the women on here probably know the issues better than she does, despite not getting tons of cash in funding or the prestige of a professorship.

spanna - the article of Hines's that you posted: is it REF-able or not? Because if it isn't, why post it? And if it is, why not be clear?

Spanna do you consider Hine's conduct on twitter professional & superior to Freedman's?

I was pretty uncomfortable at the 'pathetic' comment.

I'm not going to make a snap judgment on that. It takes a lot of careful work to make those decisions

... and this isn't a place I'd advise anyone to come for a reasonable conversation.

I’d disagree. It can be robust, but it’s generally reasonable. I don’t think I’m abusive or unreasonable.

Can you point out what is unreasonable about my stance?

Hines is a professor. She is supposed to be able to articulate strong enough arguments to be able to respond to robust challenges to any theoretical positions she presents. Being a professor isn't meant to be about people being "nice": to you and agreeing with all your arguments..

Perhaps all these gobby MNers with their degrees and challenging arguments and critical questions just aren't as "nice" or banana-mush-brained as mums are meant to be in the world of progressive wokeness, eh, spanna? I mean, heaven forbid that academics have to properly defend their arguments or do what they are actually paid to do.

I'm not going to make a snap judgment on that. It takes a lot of careful work to make those decisions

I'm not saying it doesn't. But, by saying this - What a weird thing to say. Prof Sally Hines certainly has published in this REF period. You're not gonna like it though - you seem to be trying to obscure Rosa's actual point, which was that despite Sally's funding, her university is unable to submit any of her work for adjudication during this REF period.

I have no idea whether or not Rosa is correct in this but if she is, it's quite a serious reputation hit for Sally, wouldn't you say?

If you know Rosa is incorrect in what she says, it would be nice if you could say so clearly instead of posting something misleading to cast doubt on it.

It would be great if you refuted or attempted to refute the arguments being made rather than tell the women putting them forward they aren’t nice enough.

A professor in a field should not be shy of debate, and should be able to discuss the beliefs and facts their arguments are built on with ease. But I’m seeing no attempt to say WHY prof Hines believes sex is a spectrum.

Belief without proof is faith.

Thing is, none of us academics have had final decisions about what's being submitted yet so how could Rosa possibly know?

Interesting that In the Twitter thread Hines states that 'sex is experienced on a spectrum'. I think in the WH segment she said sex is a spectrum (and not binary) and brought inter sex in to it.
Is this a new narrative that she is trying to put forward as she thinks it is more defendable?
Of course there are wide ranging experiences of all aspects of our anatomy. Not sure the word 'spectrum' is a good fit though?

This is a very embarrassing series of tweets.

How very odd that Prof. Hines is effectively trying to turn a point of academic discussion between herself and Prof. Freedman into a whiny catfight.

From my glance at Prof. Hines Twitter feed the other day, I saw her actively refuse to engage in answering questions as she was 'too busy' for such things.

Thing is, none of us academics have had final decisions about what's being submitted yet so how could Rosa possibly know?

Presumably by there being or not being published work that meets the criteria for submission?