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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Butterfly - Feedback from ITV to email complaint

360 replies

ShineyNewName5032 · 24/10/2018 13:21

As many on here have noted Butterfly is possibly one of the most controversial topics covered on ITV. I wrote to express my concerns this is the response:

Dear Sir/Madam,

Thank you for your email concerning ITV’s new drama series Butterfly.

The producers consulted with senior clinical psychologists as well as the charity Mermaids. Most importantly, they spoke to families and children about their own lived experiences. The programme does not “promote” Mermaids, although the charity is depicted in a handful of scenes across three episodes. It depicts the family being advised by a range of different professionals, and indeed being offered a range of different advice, both in this country and the United States.

We do not consider that the drama is irresponsible or could “lead to more suicides”. The drama depicts a nuanced and complex story of an unhappy child, whose feelings are increasingly distressing, and which are leading to self-harming. This reflects the lived experience of some young people who are not comfortable in their assigned gender, but we do not suggest that Maxine represents all young people in this situation. It is clear that our fictional families’ problems are complex, as Maxine’s parents both clearly wish to protect their child, but cannot agree on the best course of action, and this conflict is itself shown to be damaging to Maxine’s wellbeing.

Nevertheless, thank you for sharing your thoughts with us.

Yours sincerely,

Charlie
Viewer Services Supervisor

OP posts:
Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 22:28

Oh right feminist
Now you can see into the future now?
You cannot possibly know that.
Many of these kids desist.
There are going to be some rich lawyers when all the suing starts.
Many of these kids also have other issues as anxiety and depression which is being masked by all this nonsense.

KataraJean · 24/10/2018 22:30

Velvet yes, I read a tweet a while ago from someone agonising about going to public events in case they were misgendered. I do feel sorry for anyone with social anxiety. But as a single parent of a DC with additional needs, I cannot even get to said events, never mind worry about how I might be addressed.
I have no idea if this person wanted to be called he/him/his or she/her/hers or what, but the thought that being misgendered is the biggest barrier to going somewhere, that is surely a privileged position?

Feminist4 · 24/10/2018 22:38

Well having been through horrendous periods, pregnancy and now menopause I can safely say that being transgender is far harder. I've lived through it with my daughter, I've been through the 'this is a phase' type of thinking and 'he just depressed and not female' thinking, but now I know I was wrong. Now the biggest barrier to her happiness is the lack of acceptance from others.

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 22:40

Whatever feminist clearly you have decided.

VelvetReVulva · 24/10/2018 22:42

Yes, Katara, agree. I would do my best to address someone correctly, of course, but I can’t imagine getting upset about it myself - I guess I can’t imagine placing my self worth in someone else’s hands, or wanting to make something so difficult for somebody else! As you say, there are far more pressing concerns.

Feminist4 · 24/10/2018 22:42

Yes, I have decided, as I've lived with a trans girl growing up and facing enormous challenges.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 24/10/2018 22:45

If your child's happiness is dependent on how others perceive them Feminist4 then they are not in charge of their own destiny. they are building their house on sand.

wouldn't it be better for them to have a realistic view of who and what they are?

VelvetReVulva · 24/10/2018 22:45

@Feminist4 - I wouldn’t not accept a transgender person and do feel for anyone struggling in any way. I think everyone deserves to be treated with respect. I would say though, that I get concerned when male bodied people want to use women’s safe spaces.

Having said that, I think we all just got on with it before the recent TRA aggression and proposed legislation changes.

Fairenuff · 24/10/2018 22:50

There was nothing at all in that programme that showed Max wanted to be a girl other than clothes and makeup.

11 year old girls don't wear makeup to school.

bourbonbiccy · 24/10/2018 22:50

I see it that the statement of "lived experience" as people who have actually been through what the show is dealing with and not people who are getting offended on behalf of other people.

I didn't think for one minute it shows the mother taking her son for hormone blockers for "playing with dolls" is quite clearly shows that he is unhappy in his body and has caused physical damage to himself, not just dressing up and playing with girls toys.

The father has left as he cant cope with his boy "wanting to be a girl " and he lost his temper with him and slapped him, so he left and the mother didn't trust him.

I think it is good, if not only to bring awareness that it is not just a boy wanting to wear pink and play with girls toys and makeup.

Was the show not on after the watershed so young kids shouldn't be watching it anyway and unfortunately these things do happen in real life, so could we not argue it is just trying to be realistic.

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 22:51

And the challenges of women who are now being faced with sharing spaces with male bodies. But hey the trans card trumps all.

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 22:53

I agree the make up was crazy. I know not one 11 year old who looks like that anyway.

Feminist4 · 24/10/2018 22:55

Bernard, It has been shown that everyone craves to be accepted. Loneliness is terrible for people. Many on this board enjoy being part of a group who have the same views. It's human nature. Transgender people suffer horribly from rejection and abuse. It's entirely understandable.

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 24/10/2018 22:55

But it does pass, Feminist4. Most (70-90%) gender dysphoric children grow out of it by the time they reach puberty. See this summary article.

Unless, that is, children are put on puberty blockers. In one report, every one of the patients on the blocker persisted while 90.3% of those not on the blocker desisted. Either clinicians have semi divine powers of insight or the blocker itself strongly affected the outcome for the child. This drug is not the neutral reversible intervention that was claimed...

Puberty blockers are far from harmless or benign. They sterilize kids, they halt the essential brain maturation of puberty and reduce IQ by 8-10 points (average IQ is 100 so as much as 10%). They direct children down a route of becoming lifelong medical patients. Grim stuff.

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 22:56

Thank god you turned up prawn
Was searching for those stats.

Feminist4 · 24/10/2018 22:58

Prawn, I won't read anything on Transgender trends. It's a hate website against trans people.

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 23:00

Lol. Seriously feminist it really isn’t.
This is quite worrying now.

Feminist4 · 24/10/2018 23:03

It is. No transgender person would ever visit that website. It has been created to persuade people that trans rights should not be given. It is a nasty place.

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 23:04

You think marketing these to 4 year olds is ok too?

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 23:05

No this is nasty

OldCrone · 24/10/2018 23:05

I didn't think for one minute it shows the mother taking her son for hormone blockers for "playing with dolls" is quite clearly shows that he is unhappy in his body and has caused physical damage to himself, not just dressing up and playing with girls toys.

What sort of treatment do you think a child in this situation needs, bourbonbiccy?

Feminist4 · 24/10/2018 23:07

Oldcrone, I think it is for the child, the family and the experts to decide what is best - not the people on these boards.

OrchidInTheSun · 24/10/2018 23:07

Transing children is homophobic. Children express their dissatisfaction and distress at rigid gender roles by saying they want to be the other sex because it's the only vocabulary they have.

The more we force children to fit those stereotypes, the more children will rebel against them. It's no coincidence that in an era where there are ever more strictly patrolled limits to masculinity and femininity that we are seeing an explosion in trans identifying children.

Telling our children they can break free of those bounds is the right thing to do - not pedalling lifelong drugs and supporting mutilation

OldCrone · 24/10/2018 23:07

I think someone has been misleading you about transgendertrend, Feminist4. You should take a look for yourself and make your own mind up.

Mrskeats · 24/10/2018 23:08

Experts like Dr Webberley?