What is ‘cis privilege’?

[MissSusanSays]

I’ve seen quite a few of the posters wo come on to make the pro-self id argument rage about ‘cis privilege’

Could one of them actually explain what it is? Because I struggle to see how women, who are oppressed by their sex and forced into gender norms, abused, paid less, over looked for promotions, given shoddy maternity care, suffer post natal depression in silence, suffer miscarriages, fight through the shame and difficulty on infertility, endometriosis, breast cancer, rape, sexual assault, menopause, hysterectomy, groping, belittling etc are privileged.

If someone who believes in ‘cis privilege’ can point out to me what privileged women have then I’d really, really like to know.

Or is it just another way to shame women into not talking about the tragic and terrifying things that happen to them because of the way their bodies function?

I think comparing a trans woman wishing she could bear a child to a toddler wishing she had pretty wings emphasises how trans women are often mocked and dismissed.

I'm not dismissing the toddler so I don't know why you think I would be dismissing the transperson. I usually feel very gentle towards children who are upset because they cannot cope with physical reality.

I cannot envisage a scenario where anyone would mock and dismiss an infertile woman for having exactly the same feelings.

I haven't mocked, I have simply said it is not a reasonable thing to feel is an injustice. And quite naturally, I wouldn't dismiss an infertile woman for having 'the exact same feelings' because she wouldn't be having the exact same feelings, she would be having the feelings of an infertile woman, not a male who wished he had the anatomy of a woman.

It is the ‘appropriating’ part I can’t tolerate. They aren’t trying to harm you or your rights.

Datun said ' It's being oblivious to your status.' Somewhere up thread which I entirely agree with.

I see cis privilege as being oblivious to the benefits of your body matching your gender identity, the privilege of your body being able to do the things you want it to (have children, breastfeed). As a woman I take all these things for granted, and recognise it must be a struggle for people who don't.

Appropriating oppressed groups is wrong. It’s like a white woman saying she was a black woman ‘inside’ and that those born black had privilege over her. It’s so racist, and it happens. I have multiple hormone disorders following childbirth that almost ruined my life. I couldn’t identify out of that and males calling that privilege, are bastards.

I feel for trans women having to hear your appalling pseudo feminist arguments.

You seem to work on the assumption that transwomen are some homogeneous group who all subscribe to the same idea of "transgender" and support self-ID.

I do not have a gender identity so my sex does not match it

SO a barren women Does not have cis priveldge?

A woman who cannot breastfeed has presumably no cis-privilege either.

I see cis privilege as being oblivious to the benefits of your body matching your gender identity, the privilege of your body being able to do the things you want it to (have children, breastfeed). As a woman I take all these things for granted, and recognise it must be a struggle for people who don't.

But it's not oppressive to men! Neither is it a disadvantage. Men can have children, you know. And many of them do. Including many of them who identify as women.

Men who crave female anatomy are fetishing it. They also fetishise women's infertility by claiming they are the same.

You deciding that that has something to do with the privilege of women is very wrong.

I usually feel very gentle towards children who are upset because they cannot cope with physical reality.

I think gentle is good. And if you had the pretty wings the toddler so desperately wanted then I am sure you would understand how privileged that made you in their eyes.

And here we go again. The biological argument.

I see cis privilege as being oblivious to the benefits of your body matching your gender identity, the privilege of your body being able to do the things you want it to (have children, breastfeed).

Oh come ON.

I'm infertile. Does that mean my 'cis privilege' is less than yours? But I don't want children, so being infertile wasn't an issue for me. However my body doesn't do what I want to it to do, which is have the flexibility of an Olympic gymnast. Presumably I should turn up to the Tokyo 2020 games waving a banner at Team GB telling them they have 'cis privilege' because they can do double somersaults and I can't.

You are also missing the point that gender identity is fuck-all to do with biological sex. Gender is a stereotypical load of societal bollocks. Life is unfair, people are different. Some have won the genetic lottery and are born with attractive bodies and facial features. Others are super intelligent, or driven, or empathetic. The argument of 'cis privilege' is a fashionable and woke way of saying "I'm jealous because life has given you something that I want".

I think gentle is good. And if you had the pretty wings the toddler so desperately wanted then I am sure you would understand how privileged that made you in their eyes.

That would mean that everyone in the world is privileged over someone else. By dint of the fact they have, a better car, house, dress, ring, boyfriend, set of teeth!

Datun I know many trans woman have had children (as men) before their transition but I am sure you are aware that taking female hormones makes one infertile. Pretty quickly I believe.

I'd say that the very definition of male privilege is for a man to declare himself to be a woman and have it believed...

I think the very definition of privilege is having stuff (material or otherwise) you take for granted but someone else desperately wants.

No, that’s not priveldge its envy

And here we go again. The biological argument.

Biology pretty much IS the argument.

Envy is for the unprivileged.

Nope. Envy is wanting something that isn’t yours, you don’t deserve and have no right to

Yes. It’s an easy argument. They can’t be women as they haven’t got a cervix. Who cares. I wouldn’t know I had one if someone hadn’t told me.

And gone on, does that mean no barren women is not cis priveldged?

How fortunate then that we have a mandatory state education system for every child in this country.

Envy is wanting something that isn’t yours, you don’t deserve and have no right to

Something the very worst straight, white males say to women.