Women's Hour Tomorrow!

[MsBeaujangles]

The consultation is going to be discussed tomorrow on Women's Hour. They are asking for our views!

I was hoping for something much better. However upsides were: the subject at least got aired on the BBC. The Stonewall person sounded like a man and his admission that he had no GRC (because he couldn’t be bothered) and and had undergone no medical treatment or surgery must have dropped a few jaws (did mine). Plus his cavalier attitude towards women’s concerns put him in a bad light.
Both the lawyer and the Irish journalist clearly had a poor grasp of the law and were unconvincing. The BBC gender person was dire.
Nic Williams got better as she went on, and Debbie Hayton was very good. I think Jane Garvey deliberately let Debbie talk about Karen White, rather than NW, because condemnation of a transgender rapist was much more powerful coming from a transwoman.
I have emailed WH again, this time to point out how unbalanced the programme was and how hopeless some of the contributors were.

Well fucking hell.

I'm a regular listener to Women's hour and I've had a vague knowledge there's a bit of an issue with the Act.

After this I'm furious. Loved the Nic lady. Horrified women's hour gave so much time to the floaty gender crap.

How can I help get this out there that women's rights are being eroded. If they have a vagina she's biologically a female and if they have a Penis he is male. This gender crap is utter bollocks and making me angry. I'm a farmer. You cannot argue with sex. That's a biological fact. Yes you can adhere to societal gender norms about what male and female are but surely that's completely up to each person.

I DO NOT want my daughter to
Start "identifying as male" because she wants to drive a combine.

And the BBC can fuck off with the complete imbalance of guests.

And the man who started off "Bex". Well. No woman would be afraid of being interviewed live by JG so what was he/she trying to hide.

Oooh I'm surprising myself with my anger about this! What can I do?'

flowerycurtain

Very reassuring to hear that someone who isn't massively clued up still sees the issue and gets pissed off when confronted with that kind of biased programme.

In terms of what to do the consultation closes on Friday. I'll post a link. Full it in, get everyone you know to fill it in. There is one click option if no one fancies answering all the questions.

Here's the link. The website appears to have been hacked to prevent people completing the consultation, so Nic has had to find a workaround.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3394063-TWO-quick-ways-to-submit-a-Fair-Play-consultation-response-this-weekend

Sorry, that was to @flowerycurtain

Thanks Datun. Will do that

MoltenLasagne thanks for your comment about the fake surrogacy case. It happened a few years ago and I didn't know any feminists at the time, only breastfeeding organisations that were shocked but couldn't get involved.

I have a lot of respect for Una Mullally, who is a smart and articulate journalist (usually) and was a really instrumental lesbian / feminist lesbian voice during both referendum campaigns in Ireland, for equal marriage in 2015 and for abortion rights this year. In the case of the marriage referendum, she campaigned and debated and championed the yes vote, all in the midst of undergoing cancer treatment, including hysterectomy age 32 (she has written and been interviewed about all of this).

I was so disappointed that she can't see the valid concerns that this issue raises about our cultural perception of womanhood, about sexist, homophobic and especially lesbophobic underpinnings of this ideology, about the rights of women and girls to protect their dignity and safety without being slandered as bigots.

Una is smart and well able to think critically. I don't think she's a handmaiden; I think she's unpeaked, pre-GC. I wonder if her participation here and the reaction to it will cause her to look more closely at what the emporer is not wearing.

*lesbian / feminist, not lesbian / feminist lesbian!

Did I mention she's a lesbian?

If anyone wants to complain about today's Woman's hour, or if you have any suggestions for their next one, tweet BBC Feedback at @BBCR4Feedback

I have a lot of respect for Una Mullally, who is a smart and articulate journalist (usually) and was a really instrumental lesbian / feminist lesbian voice during both referendum campaigns in Ireland, for equal marriage in 2015 and for abortion rights this year.

She came across as wilfully dumbing down. I liked that she called back in when kicked off the call first time, but I didn’t feel she added anything useful. So maybe you’re right - not peaked. But why not, if that’s your job? She can’t aim ignorance - except that’s how it seemed!

Whereas I actually felt Monha BBC Tumblr native might be more sympathetic to all points of view - might realise the nuances of the debate. Monha mentioned MNfir a reason...

Una Mullaly sounded like she knew next to nothing about trans issues but was simply supporting the GRA as a knee-jerk liberal 'woke' thing to do. She had no answer on the issue of segregating prison estate by gender and nothing to say on the case where a woman has been accused of harassment for asking a male-bodied person to leave a changing room either.

I know quite a few perfectly pleasant individuals like Una. They support the MeToo movement, speak out about vulnerable children and are great feminists. Unfortunately they are largely uninformed about trans issues and think it is simply an extension of the marriage equality debate, an issue of human rights. They have very low awareness of the implications of a GRA and what it means for women's equality and safety.

They also tend to assume that women who oppose the GRA are pearl-clutching old ladies who are scared of gender-bending transpeople, not the well-informed, intelligent feminists we are who have fully thought through the trans issue, certainly more than they have.

Also the ridiculous throwaway comment (I think from Una?) that 'well, men have been sexually assaulting and oppressing women for centuries so what's the big deal about a few transwomen?!?'

EXACTLY.

Men have been harassing, raping and abusing women for centuries and that's exactly why they can't be trusted in female-only spaces! Female-only spaces were created for a reason, the reason being the reality that women are just not as safe around men in close contact settings such as prisons, changing rooms, swimming pools and refuges compared to their safety in an all-female setting.

Una Mulally is a disgrace. How can she be so wilfully and embarrassingly ignorant of the issue when she has posited herself as the voice of feminism and gay and lesbian rights in the Irish Times, the supposed "paper of record"? It's shockingly lazy and arrogant. It's also an indictment of journalism and what happens when bloggers are given national platforms. No serving your time on provincial newsdesks, or interviewing the plebs about mundane stuff. Just broadcasting safely from your woke echo chamber

Anyone listening now?

They are talking about the increase in sexual assaults in prisons.

Ok so that was about training prison officers. Not the reasons for the increase in sexual assaults.

'It's shockingly lazy and arrogant. It's also an indictment of journalism and what happens when bloggers are given national platforms. No serving your time on provincial newsdesks, or interviewing the plebs about mundane stuff. '

I agree. She sounded 'woke' but very ill informed. She rather defensively said 'I understand these issues' at one point, when it was perfectly clear that she was aware that Dr Nic knew more than she did. I thought she added nothing but confusion to the discussion

She's being praised on Twitter for "standing up for trans people" by people like Helen from Mermaids. What an utter embarrassment to us.

Well, Natalie has turned up on a human rights site telling us silly women to 'relax' - there's no problem with self-ID, and women's refuges have good safeguarding.

There was an Irish feminist in the audience at Posie's Manchester gig, who stood up and said a piece on Ireland.

It was very good - I'll see if I can find it.

The question is (roughly transcribed): "Ireland have has self ID for 3 years. They now have a gay teas shop, also very brilliantly, women in Ireland have won the right for abortion. You say that if trans people have rights, and we discuss this, it is a step back for women's liberation/rights, but it seems that in Ireland women's liberation has taken a step forward."

Anne R makes the point about prisoners in Ireland being segregated by sex, not gender ID, and that -you know- it's 2018, so of course Ireland should have legislated for women to have abortions.

Then an Irish audience member answers:

"I'm Irish, although I've lived here for 30yrs. I have 6 sisters, we're fortunate we've never needed a shelter for refuge, none of us have ever been in prison, but I'd just like to say from an Irish woman's perspective, the general public were not consulted about Self ID, only trans organisations were consulted about the legislation.

It went in, as Anne says, under the radar, my own sister wasn't aware of it until I told her I was coming to this meeting tonight and had a discussion about how Ireland operates.

It's interesting to me that Self-ID was brought in 3yrs ago, and it's only this year that women are actually allowed to have abortions. For the last 3yrs, Ireland Ireland has been a country where a man can self ID into a refuge but interestingly not the priesthood. A man can self ID into any sphere, except where it affects men directly themselves. But it's only this year, in the last couple of months, that women have actually been allowed to have abortions in their own country.

Why is it that men's access to women's spaces was prioritised over women's health and women's rights?"

Starts at 1:24 on the video.

I like the idea of a gay tea shop. :)

Me too, but I think it's a mis-transcription of taoiseach...

Shame....

but I think it's a mis-transcription of taoiseach...

Of course! Sorry to my Irish sisters.