Child in my class is trans

[theresheis]

Looking for some advice. I'm a long time lurker and whilst I have read lots of the posts surrounding the issues of trans rights and consider myself firmly in the gender critical camp I am not fully up to speed with the current legal situation surrounding the trans debate.

I am a primary school teacher and I teach eight-year-olds. I have a boy in my class who at home is going by a girl's name, using female pronouns and wearing girl's clothes. This has not happened at all in school and he has not spoken to his peers about this. His mum spoke to me recently and said she had taken him to the GP. She is supporting him but seems to be not overly pushing it. She is a single mum and she is somebody who I would describe as vulnerable.

His mum now has another GP appointment next week without the boy. I am wondering whether the GP is likely to signpost a charity which will advocate a transition?

I would like to know where I stand as his class teacher if it comes to it am I required to call him she/her etc?

I would say that none of the staff in the school would be aware that all of these issues and broadly would support his transition.

I have told the head that I am not prepared to tell the rest of the class that he has become a girl or ever was a girl. He looked pretty shocked and said he would go away and research this issue. Where could I suggest he looks?

Sorry quite a long post! Hope I've posted in relevant section.

Can I just say that Transgender Trend have interesting report with how data was gathered in this ‘suicide’ tactic that is been banded about as Trans being the only delicate snowflakes ever to suffer.

This ended up on twitter

so blinking what? the person who made that twitter post sounds frankly unhinged

if they want to embarrass themselves in public that's their own business

That Twitter account is not a reliable source.

There are some important resources on this thread.

People can check out the sources linked on this thread and consider them for themselves.

Especially true for those professionals involved with education, social care etc.

its funny they rely on mumsnet a lot for there info and how and who to approach.

They can’t come up with there own ideas, they so secure in their ‘product’ but need moles everywhere. 🖕🏻

What’s scary they making excuses for that Dr.Helen, a law upon there selfs

There's nothing illegal on this thread.

Hey there Trans activists: get this

SELF-ID IS NOT THE LAW.

And it NEVER will be for children. Ever.

TransgenderTrend:

"At a conference in Bristol in October 2017, Dr Polly Carmichael, Director and Consultant Clinical Psychologist at the Tavistock, stated that the PACE survey is “deeply flawed” and that rates of self-harm, distress and suicidal ideation are similar to CAMHS figures overall. Dr Carmichael’s full talk is available on this page and we summed it up in this thread.

Dr Carmichael expressed concerns about the use of suicide statistics in the discourse around gender dysphoric young people which is so negative, and suggests a lack of agency and resilience.

This is our position. Every suicide is a terrible tragedy and we must be extremely careful in any message we send to young people on this subject. The Samaritans guidance states that we should avoid speculation about any one ‘trigger’ for suicide and that we need to exercise caution in repeating suicide statistics. We would like to see this advice followed more carefully in the case of young people struggling with gender identity issues."

www.transgendertrend.com/the-suicide-myth/

www.transgendertrend.com/stonewall-school-report-what-does-suicide-rate-mean/

I’ve been posting that link over on twitter every time I see a post that says trans suicide is basically the reason why it happens. Also new tactic is saying trans death is just as significant to those who die of cancer. I can’t say no more without turning it into sweary rant.

So thanks for posting that link R0wantrees

I get the impression that we (TRAs, GC feminists and those who think themselves neither) all agree on a number of things?

1. Priority number one is making sure this child is free from bullying, safe and supported. Kids at such a young age are much more accepting of gender non-conformity than people think, but bullying is still the most immediate risk for any vulnerable child who stands out.

1. The comfort and safety of all the other children is equally important. Hopefully at this age it's a non-issue and any difficulties around things like toilets should have easy solutions.

1. School uniform should not be determined by their sex and (for example) boys wearing skirts should also be a non-issue.

I would hope the posters concerned that feminists are somehow suggesting action which is not in this child's interest would accept the following:

1. A primary teacher spends a lot of time with a child. Inevitably they do more than just educate facts. This teacher is trying to become informed and work through concerns before they occur. She has stated clearly that the child's needs are her primary concern. It does no good to slag her off, post on twitter and infer intentions she doesn't have.

1. 8YO is very young to make a complete social transition. Caution should be exercised, professionals should be take the lead and the child shouldn't rush into behaviour which may stigmatise him (however wrong that stigma is, it exists). Nobody (of any viewpoint) should superimpose their expectations on this child.

1. A teacher cannot say that a male child has become female, because it is not true in any legal or physical sense. If a child is fully socially transitioning then the teacher needs to address the idea of gender, communicate expectations of how to treat, and address, this child respectfully but still communicate biological reality. They cannot teach 'sex is a spectrum' any more than they can teach 'evolution isn't true'.

[Personally, I feel strongly that the OP should use the requested pronouns (if, with medical supervision, it is eventually the recommended course) because to do otherwise risks upsetting the child. I accept others may disagree.]

1. Constant talk of suicide on SM promotes suicide ideation. It would be better is everyone stopped bringing this up when that is not what this post is about.

I don't really see the need for name calling, allegations of bigotry, or threats about legality from people who aren't lawyers on a topic never tested in court. Ultimately it is OP who has to deal with all this- perhaps we could try to help with some links to support (as many posters have)?

I was just letting OP know that someone had posted it, I thought the twitter post was ridiculous. Nothing illegal in this thread. I find the TRAs quite entertaining.

You only have to look around the boards at the discussion about children, they are very much at the forefront of our concerns. Seems likes they only best place to hold such discussions are over there as they only stalk this section.

Id like to see brave fools take there cult stuff over there.

Yes go and tell those who are fighting cancer that trans suicide (yes apparently only trans suffer suicide they would have u believe) is just as significant as those with cancer, yes cancer that nobody has a choice of. Yes let’s tell parents of Autistic children that their children are probably in wrong body. Fuckwits

@LangCleg as a teacher I am fully aware of safeguarding and reporting and always follow the guidelines - and inform the child correctly.
I am not sure what you are getting at.

as a teacher I am fully aware of safeguarding and reporting and always follow the guidelines - and inform the child correctly. I am not sure what you are getting at.

I am getting at exercises and recommendations contained within the trans lobby guidance given to schools and asking you if you would be happy if your school adopted this guidance even though it contravenes Working Together on the specifics I laid out. I am asking you for your opinion on the specifics I laid out.

I'm also concerned that I have asked these questions of hundreds of people who support the Allsorts guidance (not saying you do) and they have never, not even once, engaged with these specifics.

Can you engage with any of these specifics in a specific manner?

It's interesting how angry and upset people get when suicide stats are shared. It feels very victim blamey (or ally to victim blamey).

What if we stopped talking about suicide and just talked about the stats for severe self harm, depression and anxiety. Or moderate self harm, depression and anxiety. Would that be better? At what point does it become valid to report stats?

As an aside, I haven't seen the Allsorts thingy but will have a look. I've got loads of kids and a busy FT job so people might not get the detail requested (hence the use of the Mermaids post- no point in rewriting something) but will do my best

spanna, the way the suicide issue is presented is against the Samaritans guidelines which are in place for a very good reason. Objecting to them being used as leverage is not victim blaming, it's asking people not to be so irresponsible in the pursuit of point scoring.

It's interesting how angry and upset people get when suicide stats are shared. It feels very victim blamey (or ally to victim blamey).

Not really surprising that people object to you changing the subject to suicide on an unrelated thread when this has been shown to promote suicide.

I'm surprised you got 'angry' and 'upset' from the requests for you to stop. Tone is hard to read on t'internet, but I think you might be worse than average.

I'm skeptical that you are a victim of suicide.

*spannablue

I am always surprised when people talk about transgender trends' bias whilst pretending that mermaids and stonewall have no bias at all.

One thing to consider is that most parents with a child with suicidal ideation will clearly do anything to help them. That's important to consider when we're thinking about parents' support of their trans kids.

However, let's do a thought experiment: if we accepted that discussion of suicide was irresponsible, what do you reckon to discussing self harm, depression and anxiety?

I do agree with some of what Polly C says re pathologising and resilience. Many trans kids are fine, and those that aren't are likely to be suffering from the impact of minority stress rather than any innate issue.

BoneyBack- of course they are all biased. All three organisations take a view- it's part of their reason for existing

spannablue

So which should a teacher follow? the two that advocate transition or the one that advocates counselling and sits inline with safe guarding policies?

So which should a teacher follow? the two that advocate transition or the one that advocates counselling and sits inline with safe guarding policies?

Safeguarding policies which also have other children who might be affected in mind. And which specify that 'secrets' cannot be kept.

Safeguarding policies which also have other children who might be affected in mind. And which specify that 'secrets' cannot be kept.

This^ from VickyEadie.

However, let's do a thought experiment: if we accepted that discussion of suicide was irresponsible, what do you reckon to discussing self harm, depression and anxiety?

Samaritans advise that discussing suicide in this way is wrong. Do you disagree with them?

I'd like to see what Samaritans actually say on this.

However, I don't think talking about mental health is wrong.

It's not wrong to discuss it responsibly. But there are huge issues around social contagion, not to mention the phenomenal blackmail element of suggesting to those of us with trans identifying children that unless we do as certain people tell us, we are putting our children at risk of death. If you want to talk about victim blaming and manipulation, that is precisely what we object to. This is not a thought experiment for many of us.

I'd like to see what Samaritans actually say on this.

Samaritans have a wide range of resources including media guidelines, schools etc.

All on their website.

All well-established principles about responsible discussion about suicide, self-harm, mental health and emotional well-being.