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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Shocking levels of transphobia

325 replies

Semp · 29/09/2018 01:40

I have been lurking here for a while and reading through the posts on a daily basis. I am truly shocked with the levels of transphobia that exist on this board. I have read what has been posted and the arguments that have been put across against the reform of the Gender Recognition Act; and all I see are the same arguments that have been used in the past when it came to changes in the laws relating to any other minority. That being that predators will exploit this change to abuse women/girls, yet everytime this has happened in the past the claims that they would did not come to fruition.

I can see no change as to how things would be any different with this change. As now things currently stand trans women can already use womens toilets, are put on ladies wards in hospitals when getting treatment, can use female changing facilities in swimming baths and so on. This has been happening for decades and Armageddon hasn't happened.

There are many other areas of life that this energy could be and should be directed at, which would make a huge difference to the lives of women. Without victimizing and stigmatizing a minority group that already suffers enough as it is.

OP posts:
noeffingidea · 29/09/2018 11:12

Should add, I am not accusing any of the above sites of being transphobic, just that they seem very open to people expressing their thoughts and opinions on the subject without necessarily agreeing with any particular position.

Datun · 29/09/2018 11:18

We have seen countless elderly people come on this boards trying to help understand , now , very few will come and engage because it looks like MN posters require at least one sacraficial person with a Transsexual past of 30 0r 40 years to destroy daily

As a solicitor they could come to me or The Police to report this abuse ,but it would seem many folks from the LGBT community wants people to see exactly what some MN posters with suspect religious agendas /objections want to see happened not only to Transsexuals , but we suspect if these people succed they will then move on to us elderly Lesbians ? Gay men ? then where Blacks? Jews ? Muslims ?

Utterly deluded.

AngryAttackKittens · 29/09/2018 11:21

Anyone else making a mental list of the former commenters who that could be?

cushioncovers · 29/09/2018 11:29

So op hasn't been backHmmHmm

2rebecca · 29/09/2018 11:33

I use folk sometimes, but have lived in Scotland for over 20 years and don't see it as a twee unusual word. It's just a synonym for people. I'm surprised so many people dislike the word.

HamiltonCork · 29/09/2018 11:38

Yy to foxylizy being a pretend lesbian. Utterly laughable.

AngryAttackKittens · 29/09/2018 11:40

I think it's a rule of the internet in general that anyone with a username like "hotsexybabeinthong" is a man.

SophoclesTheFox · 29/09/2018 11:44

Arf! I thought it was just me reading their posts and going "nah, mate" Grin

UpstartCrow · 29/09/2018 11:51

I am having my own wimmin only soiree right now. Beans on toast with me and and next doors cat; thence we shall move to the front room with some Mellow Birds. (I find the name is more appropriate than kenco, which has a mans name)

terryleather · 29/09/2018 11:52

Wrt to the use of folk , I used to use it all the time and as a few pps have pointed out it must be regional as it's common to use it here in Glasgow.

However, I'm trying to stop using it as I agree that it's beyond irritating now thanks to over use by the woke...

DancelikeEmmaGoldman · 29/09/2018 11:58

Ah well, according to the OP, we should be using “Volk”, anyway ...

AngryAttackKittens · 29/09/2018 12:01

Definitely regional, none of the people I know from the east coast of Scotland use it.

albert92 · 29/09/2018 12:07

The thing is.... why do people have to accept it ? You can't force things upon people and I believe people have a right to not agree with something and should be allowed that right just as much as someone has the right to be trans !
People don't have to agree with it, it doesn't make them transphobic it just means it's not something they agree with !

AngryAttackKittens · 29/09/2018 12:09

You can insist that fairies exist all you like (or ghosts, or gender identity, or whatever) but you can't actually make anyone else believe it. And by "can't" I mean "it's not possible to do so" rather than "you shouldn't".

albert92 · 29/09/2018 12:16

I'm sorry but you are biologically male or female no matter what you tell yourself of believe that you are. The answer is male or female and nothing can change that.
I can't wake up one day and decide that I'm a horse and that everyone needs to accept and treat me like a horse.
There is people dying in the world embrace the gender that you were born and stop medalling with sciences
It's not right that transgender people are allowed to use the opposite sexes toilets/changing rooms/ prisons because no matter what they believe they are still the gender they were born. That is my opinion and I'm entitled to it without being labeled transphobic. What stops a man pretending to be a women and going in a female changing room to look at little girls it's so so wrong we are allowing this to happen

TinyRick · 29/09/2018 12:34

noeffingidea Ah yes. I have read a couple of threads on LSA when it has been linked to from reddit.

Original poster
Semp · 29/09/2018 13:02

Calling Trans women men is a blatant example of transphobia; one that happens in most of the posts on this board and is not removed or moderated. You try to pass this off as a claim of sex v's gender, ignoring the personal lived experiences of people and trying to turn the debate in to a simple black and white one; which if you knew anything about sex you would know it is anything but that.

Yet every study that is done is showing things like intersexed conditions are a lot more prevalent than we first thought, and as far as i am aware transgender people are not routinely DNA tested to see if they are intersexed or not. For all we know the majority of trans people could well be intersexed.

Plus there is also very little knowledge and understanding on how the human brain works, especially when it comes to identifying how we see ourselves. It is highly plausable that trans people may well be wired up in their brain differently to men/women. Which would mean that it was not a choice and not a simple biological argument; in that you have an XY so you are male and you have XX so you are female and things are as such simply rigid and should be viewed through such a prism.

Then we come on to claims that are often bounded around; that one transperson has done something bad to women so we should tar all transpople with the same brush as an example that self id does not work. That is such a poor and overly simplistic argument. One that could easily be turned on it's head to show how silly it is, there are women like Colin Norris, Velma Barfield, Clemintine Barnabet, Bloody Benders, Debra Denise Brown, Judy Buenoano, Carol M. Bundy but to name a few examples of women doing horrific things; yet we do not say from these examples that all women are the same. So to make a claim that because one trans person has done X that all are there fore a risk is clearly transphobic. Yet when these examples are posted they are left unchallenged by the moderators.

Then lets take the toilet issue; where there is a clear misunderstanding of the law in the UK over the issue. Most of the posts here seam to think that there is some kind of law that governs the use of them and that only female's can use the female toilet and only males the males. Yet this is completely wrong, in the UK there are no laws governing this. So self-ID would not change this one bit, as effectively this is what already happens and we do not have an epidemic of men going in to womens toilets and sexually assaulting females in toilets.

Then we have had the numerous threads on the repealing of the GRA, claiming that it is not needed. Which in itself is an anti-trans position to hold. A claim that is denying people the right to have legally recognized how they live and work every day. The overwhelming majority of which cause no issues for society.

OP posts:
DisrespectfulAdultFemale · 29/09/2018 13:08

intersexed conditions =/= equal being trans.

AngryAttackKittens · 29/09/2018 13:09

It is highly plausable that trans people may well be wired up in their brain differently to men/women.

Fascinating! Evidence, please? Preferably from a peer reviewed journal that explains what "wired up" means in the context of the brain, which does not contain any wires.

Trinity1976 · 29/09/2018 13:10

No-one has said we should tar all transpeople with the same brush. You are using strawman arguments.

The rest of your post of woefully ill-informed.

LemonJello · 29/09/2018 13:14

Transwomen are men as they are adult human males.

Thats not transphobic, as it is nothing to do with hate, fear or moral disgust. It is blandly factual.

You can of course disagree, but we have never seen a convincing argument for how humans change sex, perhaps you will be able to enlighten us finally? Smile

DisrespectfulAdultFemale · 29/09/2018 13:15

It is highly plausable that trans people may well be wired up in their brain differently to men/women.

Based on what research published in peer-reviewed journals?

TinyRick · 29/09/2018 13:16

Yawn

TheCrowFromBelow · 29/09/2018 13:16

Colin Norris was a man
Velma Barfield was executed in the 80s
Clementine Barnarbet- turn of last century

To find examples of male violence, generally speaking you can look through last week’s news, not the last century as you have done to find examples of violent women.

And as ever - NAMALT

DancelikeEmmaGoldman · 29/09/2018 13:20

Sigh. You know we’re really only talking to you because there are lurkers out there who read this nonsense and might get confused.

For a start, your grasp of human biology is shaky. Humans are sexually dimorphic mammals, that means female and male. Intersex people have repeatedly asked not to be included in the transgender debate. However intersex people are not a third sex, they are either male or female with chromosomal abnormalities.

And as for this, your grasp of detail is shaky for someone who says they are a solicitor: Then we come on to claims that are often bounded around; that one transperson has done something bad to women so we should tar all transpople with the same brush as an example that self id does not work.

Women are concerned about men in female spaces, because men have a long track record of being dangerous to women. Self ID would enable men into spaces where women are vulnerable and it would be illegal to deny them entry.

Mind you, I have no conviction that you have any interest in supporting the rights of transpeople, or lesbians or elderly people or even ersatz solicitors.

Now I’m off to reread Germaine Bunbury’s great classic, “On the Semiotics of Soup”.