Trans people are NOT a threat in same sex spaces

[DonnaBe]

So says a study done in Massachusetts and reported in the Boston Globe.

“Study finds no link between transgender rights law and bathroom crimes”

www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2018/09/11/study-finds-link-between-transgender-rights-law-and-bathroom-crimes/1YWqSptLXOSiobmbH0RBMM/story.html

Maybe we can all take up hobbies now instead of hating on trans people and doctors ?

How about soup making?

Shout out for DOnna

Donna Donna !!

Questions to be answered

serbska Strange that there’s never any evidence for that, isn’t it? You’d think there would be a list of trans people who have literally been murdered,because they couldn’t pee where they wanted, wouldn’t you? Just like the ever extending list of women who are murdered by MEN.

I often read the lament of ‘they just want to pee in peace. What’s the big deal?’ Guess what? So do the women and girls, but we’re not permitted that dignity.

Male with penis in female toilet
= dangerous, so transwoman can’t use that toilet. Must keep man with ‘female penis’ safe from dangerous man with ‘male penis’.

Woman with vagina does not want to share female space with male with penis
= sensible, understandable reaction, precaution are understandable.

Woman with vagina does not want to share female space with male with ‘female penis’ = TERF! Bigot! Die in fire! Will be raped to death! Bomb threats! Doxing! Threats to job.

but....but...trans people are sooo vulnerable, suppressed, literally murdered. 🙄

But we've always had public loos split into sexes - why??

We actually haven't. Women had to campaign for women's toilets because the lack of them was severely limiting their ability to participate in the public sphere (because, as we all know, having to share intimate spaces with men is dangerous for women). It's something that women in other parts of the world are still fighting for.

Just goes to show, women can never take our rights for granted. There's always another backlash coming to try and take them away.

Quick recap on the unanswered questions.

Do you accept that a woman's "no" does in fact mean "no"?

Would you go up and make your opening statement to the face of one of the women sexually assaulted by penis-owner Karen White in a women's prison?

Do you accept that you are flat out lying when you say that it's illegal to deadname people in any circumstances, lies shown to be lies by a quick read of section 22 of the GRA?

Donna be waiting for a vagina person to make soup for Donna.

Donna be going hungry

Addendum - are you aware that "things that piss me off" and "illegal" are not the same thing?

Apologies if this has been said already, I can’t leave my bread making for sufficient time to read the whole thread.

Try this link OP, also from USA, showing increase in sexual assault in Target stores since gender inclusive changing introduced.
womanmeanssomething.com/targetstudy/

It’s not just about threat and safety Donna. For me it’s mostly being able to have some female areas “female only” for comfort, peace of mind, privacy (from the male gaze) and dignity. Then there are female sports. I’m sure many many males feel the same. I have to wonder at any male who has an issue with this - who demands women and girls can’t set these boundaries but must include males in everything female. Creepy and threatening.

I always like to look at new usernames and try and work out how people chose them. This one, for just a completely random example.

"Donnabe
A Don Draper wannabe (reference to lead character in "Madmen" tv series)

A Donnabe is man who wants to give the impression that he is the strong, silent type, who is also smart, meticulously well-groomed, mysterious, and irresistible to women."

www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Donnabe

When you read the twitter response to Pips Bunce winning his latest award, you realise very quickly just how few people want society to change in the way TRA's want it to change. The vast majority of people get it. A dress does not maketh a woman.

Donna there is a tiny amount of support for losing sex segregation. Never mind the risk of assault, most women want privacy from men in certain situations. It matters for so many different reasons. That is never going to change.

You're never going to win this one.

Not in a boat, not on a moat, not even if you threaten us with a rabid stoat!

Do you accept that a woman's "no" does in fact mean "no"?

Central to this is the issue of consent.

Establishing legal consent came out of the rulings on marital rape in the UK the 1990's

The international history and significance of these important rulings is discussed:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marital_rape

'Bathroom crimes' is not a phrase I know what with being British.

Same sex spaces:

Girl Guides.
Domestic violence refuges.
Rape crisis centres.
Lesbian bars.
Any other space that women and girls want to meet.
Any other space that women need whilst out and about in public such as toilets.
Sports: whether for leisure or professional. Swimming is a prime example for leisure and athletics is a prime example for sports.
Maternity units.
Gynaecology wards.

I made some epic soup yesterday - mexican style black bean and rice. Just the thing now the weather's turned.

It didn't get in the way of my campaigning for single sex spaces. I did that while the soup was bubbling away.

It didnt interfere with hating on trans people and doctors, because I haven't been doing that.

HTH

Think you're being a bit hard on DonnaBe here to be honest, I suspect the soup reference was her trying to do an "in-joke" re the breakfast/cake/tea discussions that tend to occur with obvious hairy-handed ones. She really doesn't deserve pulling down for that.

FWIW I think Donna is a genuine trans woman who is trying to engage us here to persuade us to her POV.

I also think that Donna genuinely doesn't see that the risk to women in women's spaces is from MEN not trans women because as a trans woman Donna has never been socialised to be aware of that risk, or experienced it herself.

Donna thinks she looks like a woman, and sees herself as a woman, so what's the problem?

I think this is one of the biggest gulfs between ordinary women and trans women, that without that female socialisation and a learned or (dare I say it) in a lot of cases even an innate fear of men then transwomen just don't get it. Because they don't have that fear, they have never experienced it. Even the way men fight men is different to the way they assault women.

Donna we don't "hate on trans people". We fear men though, we can't help it, because men can and do hurt us.

So the issue to me is that I personally don't mind sharing spaces with trans women. But other women do, and they have the right to voice their objection. Which means that even if I had no empathy for women who can't share spaces with trans women (because of religion, trauma and many other reasons) trans women need to be differentiated from men to keep me safe in those spaces. I can't think of a way to do that so until someone comes up with a foolproof way then I don't want them to come in. Not cos I hate trans. Cos I fear men. And I know that abusive men will take advantage of the tiniest loophole in safeguarding (never mind the bloody great hole that self-ID has the potential to create) to get to women and children.

Can you understand that difference DonnaBe?

Maybe we can all take up hobbies now instead of hating on trans people and doctors ?

How about soup making

WTF! Honestly, I do find men my age group really struggle to relate to women in anyway (generally) that's not patronising . They were brought up to expect women would act as their servants and get a shock when we don't. Poor old Donna.

Donna is a very aggressive TRA, don't be fooled.

I know that this is a trans thread and I usually avoid them but I do want to point out that some girls are assaulted in single sex bathrooms by other girls/women. My DD was (is) one and it is hard to read all the stuff around not letting men or trans women into single sex bathroom and changing spaces when it was born female people who assaulted my daughter.

Please I know it’s 10% or whatever but please we shouldn’t forget them in the wish to protect single sex spaces they aren’t the be all and end all.

Absolutely. Real trans people are no threat at all. But perverts who pass themselves off as trans are as illustrated by male rapists who tra a into women's prisons so that they can rape some more.

FWIW I think Donna is a genuine trans woman who is trying to engage us here to persuade us to her POV

Nope.

Donna is here to patronise and dismiss us and screenshot us for twitter. Donna isn’t here in good faith at all. Donna wants us to submit to Donna’s wants and views of the world. Which is a pretty masculine behaviour trait, incidentally.

Donna knows we don't hate trans people at all.

Donna knows this.

Which is why Donna has only replied once to this thread.

At the risk of getting deleted - actually yes, transwomen are the problem. All transwomen who think they have the right to use female spaces are the problem. Even if you're not going to rape or assault someone. I'm uncomfortable around men I don't know in areas where I'm likely to be undressed. In a female space, where I am entitled to be, my feelings should trump those of the male person

This.

Tramswomen are men. I don't care how many people have convinced themselves otherwise, it still remains a fact.

I don't want my daughter to have share places she naked and/or vulnerable with strange men. Even those who think they're women.

Yambabe I agree. I also don’t understand why many trans people find this difficult to comprehend, or assume that our objections come from a place of hate. Surely if they see themselves as women they should listen to and empathise with our fears & worries instead of minimising and discounting them.

Real trans people are no threat at all.

I should think they are about as much threat as anyone else. Are all the trans sex offenders just pretending to be trans vs really believing it? I doubt it.

But anyway the 'real trans' vs 'pretend trans' is a complete non-starter when the whole thing is based on entirely subjective feelings and directly contradicts observable reality. None of us can say oh this man really truly believes he is a woman but this man is just saying he really truly believes he is a woman and he doesn't really.