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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Trans Porn (she-cock, she-male, etc.)

125 replies

YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/09/2018 12:16

Recently I had two encounters with trans porn. One was on here when a trans poster introduced the word 'she-cock' (I think it was) and another was when I tripped over someone IRL who writes trans porn. I've also been chatting with lesbian women who have left the 'queer' scene because they don't feel safe and a couple of gay men who have left because 'kink' and 'fetish has replaced 'gay' under the label of 'queer', which has got so broad that it includes almost anyone these days (but obviously excludes a lot too). I got curious.

Anyway, I took one for the team and did some research. I was actually shocked at what I saw - and I'm not (that) naive. I was shocked at the content and at the prevalence. I was disturbed because much of this porn is produced by individuals (amateur) and distributed on private twitter accounts and the like (from what I can tell it's very 'Jess Bradley' - the individuals concerned posting not for money but because they get off on exhibitionism.

This is NSFW - but it's one example

twitter.com/lisadumonde?lang=en

Here's another (equally NSFW)

www.reddit.com/r/transporn/.

Obviously, there are also copious commercial sites - pornhub and the like.

These are not individuals who are dysphoric though, from what I can see. They are individuals who get off on having tits and a cock and from seeing other individuals with tits and cock.

Disturbingly, when I looked up 'how to write trans porn', I found site after site that was more about fetish and kink than anything else - like this one www.sugarbutch.net/2015/11/best-queer-sex-blogs/ and quite a few like this one NSFW queer-oranges.tumblr.com/post/57189374716/tips-on-writing-porn-with-a-trans-character-in-it whre the main theme was 'acceptance' (the partner 'not knowing' but having sex anyway - and, obviously, enjoying it much more than ever before).

This leads me to a few tentative thoughts. One - I think we should introduce such porn to MPs whrn discussing self ID. Second, what Stonewall and others are doing by including 'kink' in with traditionally oppressed sexual minorities is really quite dangerous. Third, I really don't want to share my intimate spaces (toilets, changerooms) with some of the voyeur individuals above. Not that I'm advertising my own post :), but I've also posted about Planet Fitness and how the trans individual in the changeroom wasn't even using the gym at the time and also described herself thusly on social media

"I will be a male Slut-in-training on a leash held my mistress, Madame Domino, with a mask made of 2 pair of black panties covering my face and most of my head under a lurid black/red wig, with my ankles, knees and wrists tied together so I can only hobble helplessly in her wake…"

Thoughts?

OP posts:
LangCleg · 18/09/2018 14:03

Miranda

Have you seen Suzzan Black's latest?

theviolenceofpornography.blogspot.com/2018/08/a-comparison-between-straight-and-trans.html

Interested to hear what you think if you have.

CONTENT WARNING FOR EVERYONE

ArmchairAnnie · 18/09/2018 14:05

I think we need to blow this out of the closet (so to speak). Download pictures and screenshots and send to MPs and others.

What do you think you will be achieving by that? What's the difference between this and sending your MP a piece of extreme gay porn and saying "Look at what these gay people are like"? Given that many types of porn exist isn't this actually just a lazy attempt to demonize the trans community?

YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/09/2018 14:08

Its definitely worth listening to the speech given at 'Let A Woman Speak' Plymouth by Abigail Rowland a poet, writer and former teacher talk about her previous experiences with her ex-husband. She talks about the consequences of living with an autogynephile man

I just listened. Yes. It summed up a lot of what I was thinking about this being about fetish and sex and that access to female spaces (which self-ID would provide) is part of the turn-on.

OP posts:
R0wantrees · 18/09/2018 14:09

There is an interesting book published this year called 'Trans: Exploring Gender Identity and Dysphoria, A Guide for everyone including professionals'. Its edited by gender specialist Dr Az Hakkem who has also written the introductory chapters.

The introductory chapters explain key terms etc including sex/gender, AGP, sexual attraction etc clearly.

The essays which follow represent a range of experiences and perspectives.

Some open access:
www.amazon.co.uk/TRANS-Exploring-Gender-Identity-Dysphoria/dp/1911246496?tag=mumsnetforum-21

Trans Porn (she-cock, she-male, etc.)
CaligulaBlushed · 18/09/2018 14:12

The only trans porn I've ever seen has starred trans men. I think there's a very famous trans man porn star, isn't there? Is that a fetish too?

mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 14:12

'Trans: Exploring Gender Identity and Dysphoria, A Guide for everyone including professionals'. Its edited by gender specialist Dr Az Hakkem

Really do need to read this...

exWifebeginsat40 · 18/09/2018 14:13

racecardriver

If I was having sex for the first time with a man and put my hands down his trousers only to find a vagina I would definitely be running off and reporting to the police. I would launch a private prosecution if I had to. That is without a doubt sexual assault

‘hello? police? i’d like to report someone for having a vagina. what? well, i was expecting a penis, you see, so....hello?’

come ON, now.

placemats · 18/09/2018 14:15

No one is demonising anyone with regard to porn. I think we are all agreed porn objectifies a vulnerable group of people. I've never seen male heterosexual on male heterosexual porn. Because, of course, it doesn't exist.

But I do agree that sending just trans porn to your MP is a nonsense and will only serve to make them believe that it's transphobic.

Annie

placemats · 18/09/2018 14:17

It's deception though and done without consent. I bet the police would proceed with a prosecution. exWife

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 14:23

So the conclusion I draw from the blog Lang linked to is that many men hate women so much that the only way they can masturbate to the idea of sex with a woman and not have it involve brutality is if the "woman" has a penis.

R0wantrees · 18/09/2018 14:23

'Trans: Exploring Gender Identity and Dysphoria, A Guide for everyone including professionals'. Its edited by gender specialist Dr Az Hakkem

I noticed that Dr Az Hakeem was with Julie Bindel the focus of emails between Jane Fae and Natacha Kennedy when they attempted to have both blocked from a conference... I think the source was somewhere on the recent thread about Kennedy:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3359116-The-Times-smear-campaign-by-trans-lecturer-at-Goldsmiths

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 14:24

(If DH and I ever split up I'm moving to a desert island, unless someone can show me how to get to Themiscyra.)

R0wantrees · 18/09/2018 15:14

2011 Link to the correspondence form Jane Fae and Natacha Kennedy to Royal College of Psychiatrists with regards Dr Az Hakeem and Julie Bindel's appearence at conference:

(extract)
NK: "I would like to raise serious concerns with the way the conference "Transgender: Time to Change" has been constituted. The presence of Az Hakeem being one of the main elements to this,
although Julie Bindel's presence is highly problematic also. I have just read Hakeem's most recent paper and I am preparing an academic response to it. I am particularly disappointed that someone who produces such a low standard of
publication should be permitted to address a conference of this type. Hakeem's paper appears to present trans people as problematic in themselves, which is a proposition that trans people cannot, and will not accept. The kind of
problematisation which Hakeem proposes is in itself transphobic.


As such Jane's description of the conference being regarded as analogous to a Nazi grouporganising a conference on Juadism, or indeed Robert Mugabe organising a conference on Homosexuality is, thus far the way this conference is being regarded by the trans community around the country, and indeed internationally.

The fact that Julie Bindel, who is neither a psychiatrist nor an academic has been invited to speak (and then, as Jane says about a version of feminism which is particularly marginal) has further discredited both the conference itself and the RCPsych." (continues)

uncommon-scents.blogspot.com/2011/04/email-correspondence-with-royal-college.html

Julie Bindel
twitter.com/bindelj/status/1038361263078813697

Apologies for the slight derail

mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 15:25

As such Jane's description of the conference being regarded as analogous to a Nazi group organising a conference on Juadism, or indeed Robert Mugabe organising a conference on Homosexuality is, thus far the way this conference is being regarded by the trans community around the country, and indeed internationally.

Transperbole.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/09/2018 15:31

Transperbole has made my day.

OP posts:
placemats · 18/09/2018 15:35

And mine. Grin

I have a wonderful anecdote regarding hyperbole that I can't put on here because it involves academia.

WhereDoWeBeginToCovetClarice · 18/09/2018 16:28

I just don't understand how anyone is supposed to want to fuck it, to be blunt. It's like getting hot and bothered about dentures, or a pacemaker - not part of the mental body map.

I bet you there are some weird sicko blokes who get off on dentures and pacemakers.

BeyondAnOmnishambles · 18/09/2018 16:51

Well, I've heard of men who want to stick their dick in stomas...

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 16:52

Some day we may find the thing that men don't want to stick their dicks in, but today is not that day.

WhereDoWeBeginToCovetClarice · 18/09/2018 16:56
Grin
WhereDoWeBeginToCovetClarice · 18/09/2018 17:00

Beyond that is disgusting. Why do men have such a weak throw-up reflex when it comes to disgusting harmful things to do to get off?

LangCleg · 18/09/2018 17:03

Well, I've heard of men who want to stick their dick in stomas...

Eye bleach! Eye bleach!

failingatlife · 18/09/2018 17:06

WHY did I Google non standard vaginoplasty EnvyEnvy. Eye bleach please!

doedoe90303811 · 18/09/2018 18:20

I see a process as follows:

The death of 'depravity'. Most cultures and past Western cultures have viewed certain behaviour as 'depraved'. 'Depravity' is not really objective, but our reaction to, for instance, to no longer believing that, say homosexuality is a moral crime, has been, in many cases, to say that ALL sex is good.

Hence many young people are far more concerned that you might be 'kink shaming', say, people who engage in sado-masochism, than believe that there is anything wrong with sado-masochism.

Here you have for instance the case of R v Brown (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_v_Brown), which was gay men injuring each other for s+m, and which the sort of people who write Wikipedia and hang around on Twitter and what not, think is a horrific abuse of human rights, because why shouldn't be able to fuck each other to death.

In the same vein you had some wanker put out a completely fake bullshit story in the Independent claiming that the government had 'outlawed female sexual pleasure'. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/a-long-list-of-sex-acts-just-got-banned-in-uk-porn-9897174.html

This was completely fraudulent lies by a porn advocate, as the government had not outlawed any kind of behaviour, but had merely extended the scope of existing rules (which are not encoded in legislation but case law and BBFC guidance) to on-demand porn without changing them. And in any case, porn is fake and very little female pleasure is involved. And much of what they said wasn't even banned under BBFC guidance and case law.

But anyway, the woke folk were horrified at this 'kink shaming'. How dare choking women to the brink of death be deemed obscene! It's for the woman's pleasure doncha know, at least so wrote Christopher Hooton: pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1012044965462073344/p2reRBe4_400x400.jpg

And you had lots of very woke men & women, like Molly Arthurs, who claim for sex work as part of their working class struggle, in the same vein.

Everything sexual is good, all restraints on sex are evil and wrong.

There was no shame for David Challenor in publicly 'liking' bondage rape porn on his Deviantart account, because there can be no shame in sex and there is no shame in pornography, because the only people opposed to pornography are crazy religious lunatics, and possibly some weird old feminists. So 'like' away on that naked, gagged woman, removed of body hair, tied to a tree. And not very far from that to doing the same thing to a 10-year-old girl in his attic.

Then you have lots of atheist, largely autistic men who consume pornography online from sites where every possible thing you could think of and plenty you couldn't is in a massive menu. They may start, like a certain prominent transactivist did, on 'adult baby' sites, publicly declaring that they are 14 years old and newly into the 'hobby'. None of the readers are going to say 'hey kid, you're too young for this' - nope, sex is NOT shameful, and well kids are going to read it anyway, so you shut your puritan mouth, bigot. Never mind that the next post might be a guide to making yourself permanently incontinent for fetish purposes, the important thing is you must never kink shame, it's the internet and kids have free access to it, and if they're here, well they're old enough.

And said transactivist might decide to give up being an adult baby and go elsewhere. As in this case, to My Little Pony. Which is also hugely popular with atheist autistic males. And what do you find there? Well 'Rule 34' applies, and it's more porn of course. Just involving cartoon ponies.

And of course you don't really ever give up your porn fetishes, nope you go and find more and more content. From adult baby you get to babyfur. From babyfur you get to FEMALE babyfur, since when you're actually rather a sexually unappealing overweight man, well it's much more fun to identify as a cute little puppy or whatever, and why not be female because it's all fantasy, so one sex is as good as another.

And then you meet people who tell you that actually no it's not just make-believe, you really are a woman.

To wit:

old.reddit.com/r/MtF/comments/9f6pbg/is_it_just_a_fetish_for_me/ (this is a Malaysian man, Malaysia does not have an autogynephilic tradition - this is purely something picked up through the internet)

There are multiple transwomen who transitioned after moving in with the same 'furry' transwoman (poly - don't kink shame bigot). These people have MULTIPLE fetish profiles in different furry identities and identify people they are having sex with as 'mommy', 'daddy', 'sister' 'brother'.

These identities are often 100% porn-fuelled. I include sexual roleplay as transgender baby animals and babies as porn, since it's based on imagery.

I don't see that becoming a 'babyfur' is something that very many people would do naturally. But when you are on the internet, it's just a couple of clicks from being on, say, a video game website, to a whole interconnected network of 'babyfurs'. Twitter is infested with them. And it's not going to take long when you have got armies of people on online forums telling you you ARE a real woman, you're not just engaged in a porno fantasy, the fact that you fantasise being raped by a muscular stud (www.reddit.com/r/MtF/comments/9ggyu0/nsfw_just_did_anal_for_the_first_time_and_managed/e65irtn/) well that's all just proof that you really ARE a woman.

And of course the biggest misogynistic bullshit of all is that while men are told that their fantasies about being anally penetrated by a big cock means that they are actually a woman, and how dare you suggest not, and oh have some jobs in a political party, and no don't you dare ask if I have a penis you disgusting TERF bigot, the same doesn't apply to women. Nope women are busy raising money to cut off their breasts, get hysterectomies, and then suffer a lifetime of severe urological complaints with their phalloplasties.

You can literally look exactly like a man, take no hormones, and have a fully-functioning penis, and you MUST be called a woman, whereas women and girls are being encouraged to mutilate themselves with hormones & surgery so they can become men (except rapists don't care what you identify as www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/15596180.Transgender_victim_glad_he_reported_rape/).

So no, when you have arrived at 'transgender' via the consumption of furry and My Little Pony porn, it's difficult to argue that you belong in women's spaces, since women and girls are socialized from birth into female spaces, which do not resemble pornography in any way.

Female spaces are not necessarily exclusively female, but the process of deciding, say, that a certain bloke can come on your girls night out, is that said bloke has appropriate boundaries and is not a creepy fucker, and not in any way based on some sort of 'gender recognition certificate' that says he is a lady despite all his behaviour screaming 'male'.

This is why trans rights activism is so aggressively misogynistic, because it is about the enforced imposition of men upon women. And it's one-way traffic, because men aren't scared of women. A transman in the gents loos is at risk, not a threat.

And no matter how many lovely transwomen there are, this is besides the point - as Jordan Peterson notes, he is willing to refer to transwomen as 'she', but if you behave like a 'he', then that's the pronoun he's going to use, and nobody can compel him to think otherwise.

Viago · 18/09/2018 18:47

Cracking post Doe ^.

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