Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Trans Porn (she-cock, she-male, etc.)

125 replies

YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/09/2018 12:16

Recently I had two encounters with trans porn. One was on here when a trans poster introduced the word 'she-cock' (I think it was) and another was when I tripped over someone IRL who writes trans porn. I've also been chatting with lesbian women who have left the 'queer' scene because they don't feel safe and a couple of gay men who have left because 'kink' and 'fetish has replaced 'gay' under the label of 'queer', which has got so broad that it includes almost anyone these days (but obviously excludes a lot too). I got curious.

Anyway, I took one for the team and did some research. I was actually shocked at what I saw - and I'm not (that) naive. I was shocked at the content and at the prevalence. I was disturbed because much of this porn is produced by individuals (amateur) and distributed on private twitter accounts and the like (from what I can tell it's very 'Jess Bradley' - the individuals concerned posting not for money but because they get off on exhibitionism.

This is NSFW - but it's one example

twitter.com/lisadumonde?lang=en

Here's another (equally NSFW)

www.reddit.com/r/transporn/.

Obviously, there are also copious commercial sites - pornhub and the like.

These are not individuals who are dysphoric though, from what I can see. They are individuals who get off on having tits and a cock and from seeing other individuals with tits and cock.

Disturbingly, when I looked up 'how to write trans porn', I found site after site that was more about fetish and kink than anything else - like this one www.sugarbutch.net/2015/11/best-queer-sex-blogs/ and quite a few like this one NSFW queer-oranges.tumblr.com/post/57189374716/tips-on-writing-porn-with-a-trans-character-in-it whre the main theme was 'acceptance' (the partner 'not knowing' but having sex anyway - and, obviously, enjoying it much more than ever before).

This leads me to a few tentative thoughts. One - I think we should introduce such porn to MPs whrn discussing self ID. Second, what Stonewall and others are doing by including 'kink' in with traditionally oppressed sexual minorities is really quite dangerous. Third, I really don't want to share my intimate spaces (toilets, changerooms) with some of the voyeur individuals above. Not that I'm advertising my own post :), but I've also posted about Planet Fitness and how the trans individual in the changeroom wasn't even using the gym at the time and also described herself thusly on social media

"I will be a male Slut-in-training on a leash held my mistress, Madame Domino, with a mask made of 2 pair of black panties covering my face and most of my head under a lurid black/red wig, with my ankles, knees and wrists tied together so I can only hobble helplessly in her wake…"

Thoughts?

OP posts:
longtimelurkingtrans · 18/09/2018 13:25

I've stumbled across it and they mainly seem to be from foreign countries where you have to buy your own healthcare from HRT right through to life saving drugs. I'm of the mind that they are financially exploited and forced into sex work. The worst porn is our own home grown perverts who make Twitter etc, places where you have exercise caution against the inevitable D pic from those who see women and trans women as their own little fetish when you click to open a message.

BettyDuMonde · 18/09/2018 13:25

Trans porn is surely only a fait accompli IF it’s a sexual orientation (which we are emphatically told it is not) or a paraphilia (again, denied)?

R0wantrees · 18/09/2018 13:27

Its definitely worth listening to the speech given at 'Let A Woman Speak' Plymouth by Abigail Rowland a poet, writer and former teacher talk about her previous experiences with her ex-husband. She talks about the consequences of living with an autogynephile man.

Its very powerful.

Starts at 1:18

ArmchairAnnie · 18/09/2018 13:28

I must send some straight porn to my MP to prove that all straight people are perverts. Hmm

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 13:28

Well, going with that thought for a minute, if for many men AGP progresses from attraction to "shemales" to eventually donning the same costume and getting breast implants and so on themselves, isn't that a kind of sexual orientation?

Original poster
YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/09/2018 13:29

Just to clarify my statement 'as for whether these people are 'real' trans or not, it all depends on what one means by 'dysphoria', which itself is not a discrete condition, rather manifests as depression and obsessive behaviour, amongst other things' what I am trying to get at is whether dysphoria is necessary for 'real trans', and whatever 'real trans' may actually mean, it does not mean that men can become women

To me it is an interesting question because 'dysphoria' is a totally made up word to describe a range of conditions. A family member has 'IBS' and reading about this shows similar - it's a term that loosely describes a range of different symptoms.

Is dysphoria necessary for 'real trans'?

I think what I was getting at is that my impression is that a lot of the individuals in the porn were in it because it gave them sexual pleasure first and foremost.

Are we confusing each other? I'm having a 'thick brain' day today so apologies if I'm on the totally wrong page.

OP posts:
mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 13:31

And yes there is a sexual orientation for being attracted to transsexual males ('GAMP').

Who are gynandromorphophilic men? Characterizing men with sexual interest in transgender women.

Note GAMP and AGP appear related (Williams and Riedel appear to exhibit both).

mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 13:34

YetAnotherSpartacus

I think what I was getting at is that my impression is that a lot of the individuals in the porn were in it because it gave them sexual pleasure first and foremost.

Yes and my hypothesis is that a lot of men discover their trans identity that way, see how it is based upon objectification of women? Note that even most of what we used to call 'transsexuals' were autogynephilic.

Thanks for replying - you make perfect sense, it's that the subject is so complex and nuanced.

BoiledFrog · 18/09/2018 13:36

I really really don't get the point of this post at all Hmm. Trans porn exists, let's send it to MP's Hmm why exactly?

Racecardriver · 18/09/2018 13:36

I not naive about this kind of stuff. I know that the she male fetish is a big thing and often gets mixed with other fetishes but I've never actually watched any (don't get off on porn anyway, plastic breasts freak me out a bit so does anal sec so I definitely avoid this genre if I am satisfying ky curiosity). Anyway, having stated my ignorance I am shocked (mostly that it wasn't blindingly obvious) by this the main theme was 'acceptance' (the partner 'not knowing' but having sex anyway - and, obviously, enjoying it much more than ever before).

If I was having sex for the first time with a man and put my hands down his trousers only to find a vagina I would definitely be running off and reporting to the police. I would launch a private prosecution if I had to. That is without a doubt sexual assault. Its basically the same as rape porn (except, instead of admitting it for what it is) they spin this ridiculous narrative about how the victim is perfectly OK with it and actually finds that they love it.

Racecardriver · 18/09/2018 13:37

Bold fail the main theme was 'acceptance' (the partner 'not knowing' but having sex anyway - and, obviously, enjoying it much more than ever before).

Racecardriver · 18/09/2018 13:37

Oh dear, well you get it.

Original poster
YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/09/2018 13:38

Yes and my hypothesis is that a lot of men discover their trans identity that way, see how it is based upon objectification of women

Yes. I hadn't thought so much about the objectification bit - but yes.

'Discover' is an interesting word isn't it? It makes it sound like it was there to be discovered - instead of being constructed.

OP posts:
placemats · 18/09/2018 13:42

So by transsexual males, Miranda, do you mean men who want to be seen as women? Or women who want to be seen as men?

Getting confused. Can you tell?

LangCleg · 18/09/2018 13:43

Well, going with that thought for a minute, if for many men AGP progresses from attraction to "shemales" to eventually donning the same costume and getting breast implants and so on themselves, isn't that a kind of sexual orientation?

Well, yes, but then you're getting into Blanchardian territory with pseudo-bisexuality and all that jazz.

Definitely not allowed in wokeazoid circles.

mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 13:43

'Discover' is an interesting word isn't it? It makes it sound like it was there to be discovered - instead of being constructed.

In retrospect I should have put 'discover' in quotes.

mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 13:45

So by transsexual males, Miranda, do you mean men who want to be seen as women?

Yes, I always infer sax from actual sex. So a 'transsexual male' is a male like myself who is transsexual. Etc.

Original poster
YetAnotherSpartacus · 18/09/2018 13:46

In retrospect I should have put 'discover' in quotes

That makes sense. But I suspect many think of it as without the quotes.

OP posts:
mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 13:47

Blanchardian territory

Blanchard is right. He did anyway evolve ideas that eg Hirschfeld was writing about in 1918. The idea of a two-type typology for transsexual males goes back at least 700 years. See for example Mukhannathun.

placemats · 18/09/2018 13:49

Yes but despite the objectification of women trans porn seems respectful and non violent (though if there is an actual woman involved, it will be a rough on the entry).

There is a difference and a misogynistic hatred for women in porn that doesn't transcend to trans porn.

Is there a porn niche for trans females, i.e females who identify as men?

We all know that horsey porn exists. So none of use are clueless in this respect. There is many an MP in a rural constituency who has to deal with the distress of horse owners whose horses have been raped by men. And it's a very serious situation.

placemats · 18/09/2018 13:50

Thanks Miranda.

mirandayardley · 18/09/2018 13:55

trans porn seems respectful and non violent

It would seem to be mainly about objectification. I have not researched the pornography per se, rather its effect on people's lives. I think there is would to be done in this area.

There is a difference and a misogynistic hatred for women in porn that doesn't transcend to trans porn

That the trans in the porn is a 'better kind of woman' and usually follows objectifying stereotypes is I think indicative of the misogyny of all performers.

Is there a porn niche for trans females, i.e females who identify as men?

Buck Angel.

horsey porn exists... the distress of horse owners whose horses have been raped by men. And it's a very serious situation.

That sounds horrific.

placemats · 18/09/2018 14:00

I agree that objectification is not respectful. No matter how it's 'presented'. Vulnerable people, and animals, are the mainstay of the porn industry.

Didn't Buck Angel have serious gynaecological problems as a result of testosterone?

longtimelurkingtrans · 18/09/2018 14:01

trans porn seems respectful and non violent

Not really I would imagine if you looked hard enough there is the violent end of the spectrum, All kinds of porn gets made if the pimp/porn producer decides that's what his employee/victim is going to make him a profit.

AngryAttackKittens · 18/09/2018 14:01

IIRC Buck had very serious problems and was lucky (given that Buck is American) to be in Mexico when the problems were found and able to afford treatment.