BISH - "proudly supported by....."

[Candidpeel]

As @R0wantree linked to on the thread on crossing out 'gender' for 'sex' on school forms, but this deserves its own thread.

Take a look at 'BISH' website for teens.

www.bishuk.com/about-you/whats-your-gender/

Has a helpful diagram. People called 'he' and who look masculine tend to be tough, active and independent. People called 'she' and who look feminine tend to be soft, emotional and passive.

He goes into schools and youth clubs and gives training to teachers on sex and relationship education with this shit! bishtraining.com/

"Our genitals are on a spectrum in terms of: how much erectile tissue sticks out (clitorises and dicks and inbetween); where the prostate is; where the wee hole is; whether the gonads are inside or outside; vagina size. Many people are in the middle of this spectrum with how their bodies are configured."

WTAF? There is a spectrum as to where the prostate is? that makes just as much sense as saying there is a spectrum as to where the uterus is between males and females !

"Currently I’m heavily involved in the DO … project. This is a campaign to make great sex and relationships education happen in schools." www.dosreforschools.com/

BISH and the DO SRE FOR SCHOOLS project are both sponsored by Durex and DO involves serious people who know about biology like the Family Planning Association, Brook and the National Association of Headteachers.

....I hope they were just not paying attention. I think we could bring it to the attention of their twitter accounts that they are supporting the promotion of sexism and absolute biological nonsense into schools.

Thank you to everyone who is raising really important issues in the threads in this forum.

A longtime lurker (and hopefully, future parent), I have finally been prompted to register and comment due to the contents of this "guidance."

The Activity Book is seriously disturbing. I appreciate young people (of an appropriate age) need sex education, but on the evidence I have seen this guy is NOT the person to be giving it, and I am seriously angry. One page of the Activity Book asks the reader to draw who they might "expect to see" in a mainstream porn clip. It's one thing to acknowledge the curiosity that might result in young people going online and looking at porn; it's another thing to talk about "mainstream porn" and getting young people to draw it, as far as I can tell to make some kind of a political point.

I will be complaining to everyone I can think of, quite honestly.

Wow, that sounds seriously fucked up.

Ugh. All the fake "down with the kids" language.... It's well complex... Having bants, my mate Meg John, Nah mate.....mixed with the porny language. It feels like an adult being totally inappropriate.

(Also I can't help reading it as Ali G)

Dammit.

I recommended Bish. I am clearly not up to date.

This is utterly depressing and should not be allowed.

Gutted.

BISH seems a strange choice of name, I wonder if it's coincidence

www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bish

And here is the person that wishes to enlighten our youth with his wisdom

www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=41&v=OGxY6wE2JC0

(shudder)

Ok I know this looks like stalking but I was curious as to the qualifications of this self proclaimed guru. I didn't find much science!

A Desmond in Law from Leeds
A Train the Trainer qualification
An NVQ (could be level 2 or 3) in P/T Youth Work

*Both of those later 'qualifications' can be completed quite easily in a few weeks/months and although people may drop out, there is no such thing as a 'fail'

Perhaps he thinks his personal experience of 'sex and relationships' is enough to give him guru status? Could his enthusiastic endorsement for porn and masturbation give us a clue as to where he gained that 'expertise'?

I was looking at this website a few days ago. Justin's invitation to schools to book him to deliver RSE popped up in my Twitter feed, probably because I follow reputable - I think - organisations like the Sex Education Forum. I was interested because I have complained to my DDs school about their lack of robust (head in the sand) approach to SRE and what teenagers face today.

I clicked on the resources for 14+. I was alarmed to read the guide to first time sex which writes nonchalantly about anal sex and sex toys.

The guide to first time sex manages not to write the word boy or girl make or female once with its 'advice' Astounding. At a time when health clinicians are being instructed in how to communicate to patients with plain language to aid health literacy, there are people out there busily writing shit to confuse our children. I don't want my teenagers anywhere near this anti-scientific crap. I'm worried that with the introduction of compulsory SRE and an updated curriculum that it is going to be hijacked by people like Justin who have little knowledge of child sexual and psychological development. Anal sex for first time sex for females?! OMG.

Here's the link to the guide

It's a shame. On the site there are some areas that are covered well. I don't think anyone should write sex education advice for young people without the input of several other people. Females, educators, psychologists etc...

My prostate is in my ear.

I imagine men would be a lot more willing to have a doctor put there finger there to check it. I mean, how the fuck can a prostate vary across a gender?

"Our genitals are on a spectrum in terms of: how much erectile tissue sticks out (clitorises and dicks and inbetween); where the prostate is; where the wee hole is; whether the gonads are inside or outside; vagina size. Many people are in the middle of this spectrum with how their bodies are configured."

Why is this person getting paid to lie to children? No, we don't all have a prostate (that just sort of floats from one location to another), and no, we don't all have vaginas of various sizes (is he calling male rectums vaginas or is this about the iguinal canals again?)

I guess he is talking about the Skene's gland @notbadconsidering which is sometimes called the female prostate. But rather than explaining theiranatomy clearly for male and female students, his main point seems to be about stressing that there are homologous structures - clitoris/penis, ovaries/testicles etc and to suggest that it's all a spectrum of mix and match options and "you cant know what anyone has in their pants".

If I was a kid hearing this and not already knowing better I'd be terrified!

They could at least have mixed up which was on what side of that sliding scale of masculine/feminine - rather than make so pointedly stereotypically gendered - even my 5 year-old's school work make sure they mix up what the 'right' answers are on a list!

Now I've seen a fair number of cocks. But they were none of them - not one - like a clitoris.

Nothing more to say on this, except, God I love MN. And yes. Even some pictures I have viewed of women who've grown their clitoruses with hormones, they're still, clearly not penises.

"some people have their genitals modified without consent, this is known as FGM".... What does the F stand for? Don't worry about that folks!....

Like KFC - lets try to forget that it's deep fried chicken bits by only ever using the initials.

If I was a kid hearing this and not already knowing better I'd be terrified!

I had a very active imagination as a child, and would have been picturing pulling someone's pants down and having various assorted arm/shark/laser beam appendages spring out. Like a Swiss army knife, but in the pants of the harmless looking person sitting next to you on the bus.

A better way of putting it, you know in terms of accuracy and all, would be to say:

There are structures that begin at the same embryological place, the intermediate mesoderm, that differentiate depending on the presence of a Y chromosome. They share similarities embryoloically, but are different in males and females.

But we know biological accuracy isn’t really important these days.

Oh my God! The explicit stuff on page 32 onwards. .! In that sort of "hey kids it's all totally cool" language..what the actual fuck??
I'm all for telling kids the truth about sex when they ask and in age appropriate language. Ds knew the basic biological facts about how babies were made at 4 because he asked me. (woman, man, penis, vagina, sperm, egg in case you're wondering Justin).
I have also discussed pornography and consent with him.
I have not considered alerting him to the various places he might like to be touched, or what specific sexual positions he might prefer. I figure that young people need to know a) the biology b) about having boundaries and c) about contraception.
What they may or may not like in bed is something that(surely?)they will figure out in their own time, gradually, with someone their own age.

How DARE this fruitloop tell children to draw porn ( expecting them to view it first??) or think about wether or not they might like anal sex?
Who do I complain to? I'm fucking livid.

Ifnotnow - yes, this, 100%

I've told DS the facts of life. I've talked about sex being great fun so long as you both really want to do it and respect one another as human beings. I've talked a lot about consent. I've talked a bit about porn (he's still very young). What I have not done, and have no intention of doing, because it would be utterly inappropriate, in fact bloody creepy and wrong, is going through the joys of sex page by page and saying "ooh, this one's one of my favourites... no, this one never did it for me, but what do you think?"

I watched a bit of "Naked Attraction" the other night - a contestant sees 4 potential partners naked from the waist down, then chest high and face last.

Whilst I was a bit that anyone would do this, compared to the BISH stuff it seems pleasantly simple and factual and grounded in biology.

We're back to the promoting porn connection again, aren't we? For 14+ (so under age)

Follow the money.....

Fucking insane

ifnotnow "I have not considered alerting him to the various places he might like to be touched, or what specific sexual positions he might prefer. I figure that young people need to know a) the biology b) about having boundaries and c) about contraception. What they may or may not like in bed is something that(surely?)they will figure out in their own time, gradually, with someone their own age. How DARE this fruitloop tell children to draw porn ( expecting them to view it first??) or think about wether or not they might like anal sex? Who do I complain to? I'm fucking livid."

Yes to all this!!

blogs.bmj.com/bmjopen/2014/08/13/anal-sex-between-young-men-and-women-often-seems-coercive-and-painful/

"All my courses are for up to 16 participants and cost £1200 per day (plus travel and accommodation costs)."

Bloody hell, his rate! Is this normal for in-school training? I worked in the voluntary sector for a decade, and attended plenty of pointless, wanky 'training', and the fees for facilitators can't have been as much as this.
MNers, some of you should become sex education trainers, and make your fortune:

Cecily, it wouldn't surprise me. I work in the public sector and our training website actually lists the costs of attending courses, and it is not at all unusual for courses to come in at £800 to £1000 per participant per day.

(If you think about it, for a genuine course, that's not unreasonable. £100 per hour would be pretty cheap for a professional billing for services, and you're not just paying for the face-to-face contact time, you're paying for the lesson prep time, which will be 4 or 5 hours for each contact hour. It is of course a complete joke for a shower of shite like this course.)

Many people are in the middle of this spectrum with how their bodies are configured.

They're really not. This seems to be the endgame of the trans attempts to appropriate intersex conditions - pretend that they're so common that any time you pull someone's pants down what you find is as likely to be a surprise as it is to be what you expected, so why would you think you have preferences? Suck that ladycock, lesbians!

if and fermats I completely agree. Great to talk about body parts and sex frankly and use the right names. But an ADULT should not be overly involved in what specifically makes a TEENAGER feel sexy. It is absolutely a form of grooming to normalise this level of involvement.