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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

First there was Jess Bradley, then the Challenors, now Edward Lord...

315 replies

PimmsnLemonade · 01/09/2018 15:10

No direct accusations against Edward Lord (the 'non-binary' freemason who is trying to remove single-sex spaces in London) but here he is describing as a "hero" a man who was a member of the Paedophile Information Exchange (PIE) and is a continuing "advocate" for paedophiles:

twitter.com/edwardlord/status/958632082762321922

www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/10948796/Paedophilia-is-natural-and-normal-for-males.html

OP posts:
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AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 09:35

Weirdy pervy men are in fact pervy and weird shocker.
In other news, sky blue, water wet, and women want good solid doors between them and these chaps.

And a nice strong set of locks also. And possibly a very large and overprotective Alsatian.

AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 09:39

Maybe some of them knew what we are only beginning to see publically on Twitter? I don't know.

It's been my experience that men (at least the ones capable of being honest with themselves) are quite aware of how far sexual perversity in men can go and how common it is, largely because other men will say things around them that they might not say around women.

R0wantrees · 02/09/2018 09:42

and women want good solid doors between them and these chaps. And a nice strong set of locks also.

Article in today's Sunday Times by Andrew Gilligan:
'Sex pests target women in mixed changing rooms'
(extract)
The majority of alleged sexual attacks at Britain’s public swimming pools and sports centres occur in unisex changing rooms, according to data obtained by The Sunday Times.

Nine out of 10 changing-room sexual complaints relate to incidents in unisex facilities — although they make up less than half of all provision.

Gender-neutral changing is growing as councils seek to cut staff costs and cater to transgender people. But one MP said it risked becoming a “magnet” for sex offenders and increased the danger to women and girls." (continues)

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sex-pests-target-women-in-mixed-changing-rooms-x3vw2lnv8?shareToken=a36cd3cca958c161bdf7b0241542caa0

thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3353054-andrew-gilligan-in-the-times-sex-pests-target-unisex-change-rooms

AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 09:43

*I don't believe he did unequivocally. He said at one point that the stigma he was experiencing was prejudice against his sexual orientation and that his not abusing children should entitle him to be free of stigma otherwise what was the point of not acting on the urges and he felt he maybe should not have bothered. He also didn't quite grasp why it was wrong, which the article does discuss.

Yep, and he also said (in forums where he felt nice and comfy) that if it wasn't illegal to have sex with children then he would, ie. he does not have any internal sense of it being wrong to do so at all.

Never trust a pedophile, they lie like cheap rugs.

AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 09:43

I swear I can usually manage bolding...

LadybirdsAreBirds · 02/09/2018 09:47

AAK

Bolding doesn't work unless you condense everything into one paragraph and put the * and either end.

LadybirdsAreBirds · 02/09/2018 09:47

at either end!

longwayoff · 02/09/2018 09:48

British Association for Counselling & Psychotherapy has defined woman. Please Google as cant link. After which can I suggest we all find our inner Northerner. FUMING

AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 09:48

In theory I should know that, but not enough coffee!

LadybirdsAreBirds · 02/09/2018 09:50

.. I just worked out the para thing myself. Feeling pretty darned chuffed with myself, let me tell you

AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 09:55

An achievement that deserves a gin!

AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 10:00

I mean, yes, the bit about being cis Northern was stupid and it's good that it's gone now, but do they really think that was the only issue?

R0wantrees · 02/09/2018 10:04

The online version of the guide seems to be no longer available.
link shows message in screenshot:
www.bacp.co.uk/media/2334/bacp-gender-sexual-relationship-diversity-gpacp001.pdf

Although there has been focus on the definition of women, there was a great deal more in the document deserving of scrutiny.

I don't know if there is an archived version anywhere?

First there was Jess Bradley, then the Challenors, now Edward Lord...
AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 10:06

Maybe they've realized that rather more extensive editing is needed.

IDontEatFriedTurtle · 02/09/2018 10:08

Why is it academic suicide (and grounds for "no platforming" ) to say you think perhaps women might have vaginas but Cambridge will host academics saying it's fine to rape 5 year olds? Have I missed something HUGE?

R0wantrees · 02/09/2018 10:09

It is indeed but the guidance that has been in place for some time needs to be considered. It has, for example relevence, to discussions on this thread and others.

R0wantrees · 02/09/2018 10:13

BACP Best Practice context December 2017;

(extract)
"It states that diversities in gender identity, like sexual orientation, are not ‘disorders’ requiring therapeutic intervention, and that counsellors and psychotherapists should ensure they are adequately trained and able to work without prejudice with all clients, regardless of how they identify themselves and their sexual practices and preferences.

Welcoming the MoU, Andrew Reeves, Chair of BACP, said: ‘We believe in a society where everyone can express their sexual orientation or gender identity. Every individual should have access to non-judgmental therapy, whatever their sexual orientation or gender identity, and it should be provided by an informed practitioner, committed to delivering skilled and evidence-based therapy.’ So far, so uncontroversial, surely? Did this even need spelling out when all the psy professions’ codes of practice make it clear that there is no place for personal prejudice in the counselling room?

Meg-John Barker, Senior Lecturer in Psychology at the Open University, therapist and activist-academic specialising in sex, gender and relationships, and author of the new BACP resource on Gender, Sexual and Relationship Diversity (GSRD), says yes: ‘Unfortunately, we have a deeply troubling record when it comes to the experiences of GSRD-marginalised people with straight, cisgender therapists. Virtually every client I see, who has experienced therapy before, has stories of counsellors trying to change their sexuality or gender, asking invasive and inappropriate questions, expecting the client to provide free education, and/or implicitly or explicitly suggesting that there is something pathological in the client’s gender, sexuality or relationships.’ (continues)
www.bacp.co.uk/bacp-journals/therapy-today/2017/december-2017/putting-gender-on-the-agenda/

R0wantrees · 02/09/2018 10:31

Word Version of the Guide still avalable from BACP:
(extract)
3.7 Sexual practice: BDSM, kink, and beyond
Definitions
BDSM stands for Bondage and Discipline, Dominance and Submission, Sadism and Masochism. The umbrella terms ‘BDSM’, ‘kink’, and sometimes ‘fetish’ or ‘leather’, encompass a range of consensual erotic, sexual, or sensual practices which may involve heightened sensations or pain, and/ or the exchange of power, and/or some form of restraint or role-play, and/or watching other people (exhibitionism) or being watched (voyeurism). Role-playing such as being an animal (furry) or being older or younger (age-play) are also common, although not always considered part of kink/BDSM. Some people regard their BDSM status or kink to be an identity, e.g. being a top or dom/me (dominant), a bottom or sub (submissive), a switch (who tops and bottoms), or a kinkster or sadomasochist. Others regard it as a practice they engage in which is not an identity. Some may keep their kink in the realm of fantasy and/or erotic reading/writing/viewing, while some engage in kink practices in solo sex and/or with others." (continues)

"Common concerns
While a person’s kink identities or practices will often be irrelevant to their presenting issues, they may well be nervous about working with a therapist – or revealing these interests – due to the continued pathologisation of BDSM (1.6), and the likelihood of having bad prior experiences with therapists (Kolmes, Stock and Moser, 2006; Kelsey et al., 2013). Kinky people are no more psychologically unhealthy than anyone else. Indeed the most recent research suggests that they may even be more healthy (Wismeijer and Assen, 2013). Nor do their childhoods differ in any meaningful way from non-kinky people (Nordling, Sandnabba and Santtila, 2000).

If people do want to discuss their kink practices or identities in therapy it may be because they are struggling due to cultural kinkphobia or people in their life who are unaccepting of their kink. Kink-affirmative therapy can be very helpful under such circumstances, as is an awareness of the various online and offline kink communities that people might find useful and supportive. Some people find their kink practices to be healing and/or therapeutic, for example as a form of stress reduction, as a way of dealing with past shame or trauma, or as a way of accessing different sides of themselves. In such situations therapy working in parallel with kink play can be very useful"

www.bacp.co.uk/events-and-resources/ethics-and-standards/good-practice-across-the-counselling-professions/

Charliethefeminist · 02/09/2018 10:33

The story is in the Telegraph today.

R0wantrees · 02/09/2018 10:46

Do you have a link Charlie ? I think someone commented also covered in the Sunday Mail

Charliethefeminist · 02/09/2018 10:48

I've tried. I seem completely unable without my iPhone.

Charliethefeminist · 02/09/2018 10:50

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/

longwayoff · 02/09/2018 10:50

Forgive me please, I havent followed this at all. Only aware of it today. I am expected to accept this guidance to professionals as a signifier of members' competence to help people with emotional difficulties? Absurd.

AngryAttackKittens · 02/09/2018 10:51

Do you remember the article heading? Should be able to find it that way.

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