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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Caroline Lucas on Aimee Challoner in the Guardian

239 replies

Latinista · 30/08/2018 16:47

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/30/look-future-aimee-challenor-trans-green-party-caroline-lucas?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Starts off promising, then segues into trans apologia and mealy-mouthed justifications why she hasn’t taken further action

OP posts:
WhereDoWeBeginToCovetClarice · 30/08/2018 17:10

Good God she sounds thick!

I used to think she has a brain. Clearly it fell out. Has someone got a gun in her back saying "talk utter bollocks or you get it"? If that is the case then bravo Caroline for making up such a stream on the spot. However, I think no self respecting person could talk such crap under duress without giving a secret sign that their fingers are crossed behind their back.

Dear oh dear.

Lefthanddown · 30/08/2018 17:10

What a crock of shit!

There are so many conflicts and contradictions within that artice I wouldn't know where to start.

WhatTheWatersShowedMe · 30/08/2018 17:10

I have lost all respect for Caroline Lucas. I hope her constituents are booking appointments to read her this filth on this.

WhatTheWatersShowedMe · 30/08/2018 17:11

*to filth on this. Fecking phone.

UnderHerEye · 30/08/2018 17:13

I’ve just posted this on another thread, but think it’s relevant here too:
I don’t know if I’m allowed to Twitter link and don’t want this to be deleted-
Aimee Challenor has been posting pictures of children playing with condoms with jokey little memes on, absolutely inappropriate, and of course zero acknowledgement from the Green Party on this.

WomblingWoman · 30/08/2018 17:16

bots systematically blocking women on social media to try to silence those who are asking whether trans rights put women’s rights at risk

Yes Caroline - some fucking written by Aimee and possibly her Father.

No mention of that hey.....

placemats · 30/08/2018 17:19

Glinner has posted on this via Pilgrim Tucker.

twitter.com/Glinner/status/1035195924434378752

BesmirchingMotherhood · 30/08/2018 17:19

Holy crap, that was bad.

Kyanite · 30/08/2018 17:20

Before this all blew up, men didn't know that they only had to put on a frock and some lipstick to get into women's spaces....and organisations weren't making female only spaces a free for all.

placemats · 30/08/2018 17:22

I'm beginning to understand the push for Self ID within the trans movement. Trans want it to be similar to coming out as Lesbian, Gay or Bisexual.

When in fact it's not.

ZuttZeVootEeVro · 30/08/2018 17:23

She's either clueless about the real issues, or understands and using diversionary tactics to deflect from talking about them.

Either way, she doesn't come across well.

BettyDuMonde · 30/08/2018 17:25

Well, this seems to be one of those ‘please none of the people’ type situations.

Cascade220 · 30/08/2018 17:27

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

EmmaGrundyForPM · 30/08/2018 17:28

Ive just read the piece in the Guardian and came on here to.see what others felt about it .
I'm appalled at Caroline Lucas. The whole article is about how there is trans-bashing. Hardly any mention of the crimes or the victim, nothing about the GP safeguarding policies and nothing about people's legitimate concerns that AC has had input into thise policies whilst thinking it's ok to have a person charged with serious sex crimes as their election agent.

I have doubts as to AC's ability to understand political debate - but Caroline Lucas should know better. I am seriously disappointed in Caroline and the Green Party.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 30/08/2018 17:29

I have faced many calls for immediate action against Aimee – calls that fail to understand the very limited powers I have as a party co-leader and that assume I would be prepared to ditch the fundamental right to due process and a fair hearing. ( www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/30/look-future-aimee-challenor-trans-green-party-caroline-lucas )

Really? Hmm

www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/05/11/green-party-suspends-former-parliamentary-candidate-after-transphobic-heckling-on-channel-4/

LadybirdsAreBirds · 30/08/2018 17:29

She feels sorry for AC. ACKCHEWLY is indeed pitiful. ACs behaviour is reprehensible. Don't let your pity blind you Caroline.

placemats · 30/08/2018 17:29

Aimee doesn't like Graham one bit it seems. This is one of Aimee's latest tweets.

twitter.com/alonelybeachhut/status/1035092837552074752

Racist overtones are obvious with this one.

LadybirdsAreBirds · 30/08/2018 17:30

AC is pitiful. Jeez autocorrect

colouringinpro · 30/08/2018 17:30

Caroline Lucas has just tweeted her support for AC and trans issues Angry retweeting Guardian article

Sorry can't work out how to screenshot

InionEile · 30/08/2018 17:30

A 10 year old child suffered horrific abuse at the hands of an evil man who was entrusted with considerable responsibility in the Green Party.

But anyway, let’s focus on not hurting the feelings of a relative of the rapist and making sure we cover our arses so the trans rights activists don’t come after us.

Ridiculous.

VickyEadie · 30/08/2018 17:32

A reminder: Caroline Lucas allowed her party to define women as non-men.

NON-MEN

BeUpStanding · 30/08/2018 17:33

I can't believe I used to actually donate monthly to the Green Party. Deep deep shame on them, and I am so bitterly disappointed in Caroline Lucas.

They will never again get my vote.

BeUpStanding · 30/08/2018 17:34

Although to be fair they lost my vote with the non-men insult, but if I could take my vote back twice I would.

carceralfeminist · 30/08/2018 17:34

Oh look. A puff piece in the Guardian. The "newspaper" that wouldn't even cover the story... This doesn't look partisan at all.

Headline:
I look to a future in which Aimee Challenor being trans doesn’t matter

Me too, Caroline Lucas, but the "trans identity" is the only thing shielding Aimee Challenor from valid criticism continuing to be heavily involved with David Challenor - arrested for RAPE AND TORTURE OF A 10 YEAR OLD GIRL. AC allowed DC to have influence on political activism and the Green Party. AC knew about the crime. AC either denied it or did not care. If this was anyone else, they would be considered for their ACTIONS. Not shielded from scrutiny by the magic wand of "transphobia."

What did you and the Greens know?

My thoughts are with the survivors of his shocking and disgusting acts.

Plural. Again. Is there more coming?

There have been bomb threats and bots systematically blocking women on social media to try to silence those who are asking whether trans rights put women’s rights at risk. If we want a more equal society we need to talk about how to get there.

The only sensible thing in this whole sorry excuse for an article.

Nor is the theoretical possibility that individuals might undergo gender reassignment for abusive purposes a good basis for law-making. It’s also worth noting that a GRC is a legal document, and results in someone’s details being formally recorded. Anyone seeking to cause abuse would be drawing attention to themselves by using that route, and it’s far more likely that most people with illegal intentions will seek to operate under the radar.

How much more evidence do you need to question this policy than an actual child rapist was campaigning FOR self-ID under the auspices of your own Green Party, the local branch of which was registered to the address where said beyond depraved crime occurred?
What about our other favourite campaigner, Jess Bradley?
There is ample anectodal evidence.
Mountains of it.
Key advisors, especially in the prison context, have warned the government of the dangers of self-ID before.
The very real knowledge that the people who are demanding access to women's spaces are using violence against women to systematically intimidate and harass them should be enough to give people pause. These are the people we should feel comforable sharing our most intimate spaces with? The ones threatening to murder, rape and bomb us? Really?
This is not hypothetical.
The very fact that Ian fucking Huntley is reportedly calling himself a woman, a paedophile has transitioned, and rapists have been sent to women's prisons should be ENOUGH.
It is happening! Already! Which is why we want to stop it!
What number of cases will be enough for you to take this seriously?
Self-ID becoming law is only making it easier for evil people to "legally exploit the system," because the whole concept will now be an unproveable internal "gender identity," not the legal categories of "sex" and "gender reassignment." And it will completely screw up our already muddled understanding of what "sex" and "single-sex" actually mean.

Women are allowed to have boundaries. You are actively promoting their transgression. Against our will.

Handwaving concerns to say that "it would happen already" is..........

I have no words.

Ofew · 30/08/2018 17:35

I'm gutted. So many mistakes and misunderstandings from someone I formerly held in high regard. I have voted Green many times and as a confirmed lefty I am in support of many of their policies. But I don't think I can bring myself to vote for a party that is so wilfully blind to the issues raised by the Challenor case.