Caroline Lucas on Aimee Challoner in the Guardian

[Latinista]

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/30/look-future-aimee-challenor-trans-green-party-caroline-lucas?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Starts off promising, then segues into trans apologia and mealy-mouthed justifications why she hasn’t taken further action

Right. Caroline Lucas is my MP. I have a meeting booked with her in a few weeks time.

Can you lot suggest what to prioritise? What paperwork to leave with her?

Where to f#cking start tbh.

I only have a short time with her so need to get this as succinct and powerful as possible. I appreciate that some of you may need a bit if a lie down after that crappy article, so whenever you are ready, I'm all ears.

If it were me I would ask her straight out whether she is still sticking by the GP statement that they didn’t know about the charges against David Challenor until he was convicted. And I would record her answer.

But other people may have more diplomatic suggestions

So sick of this :(

It's really evil for your first public comment to focus on transgenderism rather than the victim and safeguarding.

A non-trans person in Aimee's position and doing what they did would have been got rid of like a shot and be a complete pariah. And rightly so.

Oh Caroline, I had defended you up to now, but I can't do it anymore.

Why didn't she mention the animal abuse charges btw? Isn't that a key principle of the Green Party's ethics?

Because it’s not been widely reported and she said as little as she could about DC. She didn’t want to address him she wanted to defend their support of AC. I’m really not sure why, I wonder if they are calculating that AC will get support so sticking with her may minimise flack on the DC failure. They seem to be simultaneously scapegoating her and defending her.

I have finally pulled my GP membership today

She is a cowardly, cynical, morally bankrupt human being

Just a normal Member of Parliament then, Morris.

This has finally tipped me over the edge too, I have been a member for nearly 30 years but I think I'm done.

Tosh

You could ask Caroline about Aimee being a trustee of Coventry Pride who have issued this statement regarding David Challenor.

www.coventrypride.org.uk/2018/08/28/a-statement-from-the-trustees-of-coventry-pride/

The Trustees were made aware of criminal proceedings being taken against Mr Challenor in November 2016.

As a result David Challenor was no longer allowed to volunteer and was to be monitored if he attended any events.

Why then wasn't the Green Party alerted about this? It's clear, in my estimation, that Aimee Challenor, by omission of these facts, has brought the Green Party into disrepute because they continued to use their father to help with elections.

www.stonewall.org.uk/trans-advisory-group

Aimee is a trans equality campaigner from Coventry. She came out in 2014 aged 16 as she left school. She speaks openly about her experiences as a young transgender woman. She’s previously had articles in the Guardian and the Huffington Post, as well as other websites from around the world. She’s also a Trustee of Coventry Pride

Tosh

Caroline also says she has no evidence of women being in danger as a result of these changes - there's plenty collected, someone might have a link, it would be good to present that.

I’ve not seen any evidence that self-declaration has been routinely abused to gain illegitimate access to women-only spaces in any of the countries where self-declaration already exists.

Yes Nelson had that problem seeing ships.

Ignoring the minor detail that self id is very different in different countries and the numerous reports from eg chains of shops about abuse of self id it doesn't help that anyone wanting to do evidence based research can't get a grant if it risks getting the "wrong" answers.

'I’ve not seen any evidence that self-declaration has been routinely abused to gain illegitimate access to women-only spaces in any of the countries where self-declaration already exists.'

No one is arguing it is routinely abused. However abuses do occur. But if it isn't routine and only a few people are abused, what's the problem eh? Shocking.

Ignoring the minor detail that self id is very different in different countries and the numerous reports from eg chains of shops about abuse of self id it doesn't help that anyone wanting to do evidence based research can't get a grant if it risks getting the "wrong" answers.
Exactly. Offenses will be minimized for fear of "transphobia," recorded as "female crimes." Some countries still seem to have some kind of common sense when it comes to prisons. Canada is a disaster with these waxing salon cases...
The conversation should be over the second a violent rapist is transferred to a woman's jail, or some asshat tweets about jerking off in the women's room to own the TERFs.
Even rates of criminality in trans women aren't being "debunked." The only study I've seen on the subject is that trans women retain male patterns of offending (and that was in a group of transsexuals who went through the whole rigamarole including surgery - not looking at "non-binary femmes" whose transition is basically lipstick and a sparkly top).

On the subject of the Greens -
I suspect whoever knew (someone must have, given the Coventry Pride Statement) thought that the court would rule in favour of DC, so it would go away quietly. They bought the rapist/torturer's side of the story.

But is self declaration exists then access can never be illegitimate
The intensions of the person may not be honourable but it will give anyone a right to be in the space

www.greenparty.org.uk/news/2018/08/31/green-party-announces-independent-investigation-and-no-fault-suspension-of-aimee-challenor/

Frances

"No fault suspension"? You don't say!

CL made her stance pretty darned clear yesterday. What an absolute shit show. 'Due Process' my arse

If CL is acting in good faith that the GP will announce who is conducting the independent investigation.

If CL argues that would endanger the independent investigator then CL needs to reflect on that statement long and hard.

We must be told who the investigator is and their scope and remit for investigation.

"Any assertion of fault or otherwise could be prejudicial to due process"

Oh dear Caroline. You prejudiced Due Process all over the place in the Guardian yesterday

I agree Lady

Regarding the latest statement from the Green Party.

Back peddling rarely works. Especially in politics.

This latest statement opens the floodgates especially with regard to other organisations that have a say in political lobbying who engaged the services of Aimee Challenor for safeguarding issues.

Caroline Lucas is a coward held firmly in place by the idea that women must be nice.

Caroline Lucas is throwing women and children under the bus.

Caroline Lucas will find herself in a Kids Company style scandal.

Still awaiting a statement from Stonewall.

That will be interesting.

Still awaiting a statement from Girl Guides and Scouts. That will be interesting.

I think the person thrown under the bus in this instance is Aimee.

Politics is a brutal arena.

Why on earth Aimee was not suspended pending the outdone of an independent investigation on DAY ONE is beyond me.