The vast majority of male born transwomen still retain a penis

[IJustHadToNameChange]

fairplayforwomen.com/penis/

Stats for arguing with waiverers.

I get that you automatically sympathise with the male in those situations, Friendly. Also that you cannot see the point of view of the women on this thread.

Wow, just wow! I hope your friendly neighbourhood trans doesn’t live in my neighbourhood.
What they would know, if they had any notion at all of what it is to be a woman, is that their behaviour on this thread is deeply alarming, and it’s so obvious to every woman Reading that they come with a carnival float and an entire motorcade of red flags.
Your friendly, only 0.2% of the population are in prison for sexual crimes, but the man who raped me isn’t in prison, in fact it would only take one phone call for me to find out exactly where he is and what he’s doing right now. He was my best friend, before he raped me that is, so I thought he was one of those nice, safe males to be around. To be honest I don’t think he was trying to hurt me, he was just getting carried away and ignoring my nos because he wanted to fuck me. He did hurt me though, because he put his own desires before my boundaries, and at that moment he didn’t care about me or my body beyond its use to him, and no, the fact that I knew him well didn’t make me feel any less sick or violated. It’s not the 0.2% I’m worried about, because they’re in prison so they can’t hurt me, it’s all the other men like my ex best friend, who I might even learn to trust in time, before I find out what they’re really like. He didn’t rape me in a women’s only space by the way, he actually pushed me into the men’s shower room, but the point stands because I don’t know what a man’s intentions are, even the ones I think I know well. Women have a hard enough job keeping ourselves safe in public spaces, and even with the men we know well, so we are not about to allow them to bully their way into our sex segregated spaces as well. It’s a red line, and if you don’t understand that, I refer you to the carnival float and Intyre motorcade of red flags you’re displaying.
It’s your behaviour that is the problem here. You’re the one waving the red flags and charging through women’s boundaries.
And yes, I’m sickeningly aware that this post might be wank fodder for some man’s sick rape fantasy, so speaking about it, even anonymously on the Internet, is traumatic.

If women's sex segregated safe spaces are useless and women are just as bad as men anyway then why the fuck do you want to invade/destroy them so badly? Hmmm? Why? What is the problem with just leaving them as is for we women who actually appreciate the rights our foremothers fought for? Who the fuck ordained you the master of women's boundaries? Go make your own gender neutral spaces with our blessing, but leave my spaces alone.

Also, your cdc statistics - news article interpreting stats actually - the actual cdc statistics showed that almost 20% of women (the cunty kind) have been raped in their lives, compared to 1.7% of men. It also said that in the past 12 months 1.6% of women had been raped - you get that? A man's lifetime risk is my risk every. single. year. They defined rape as completed or attempted forced penetration or alcohol- or drug-facilitated penetration
Envelopment isn't penetration, so who is doing most of the raping? Well, let's see shall we?
For female rape victims, an estimated 99.0% had only male perpetrators. In addition, an estimated 94.7% of female victims of sexual violence other than rape had only male perpetrators. For male victims, the sex of the perpetrator varied by the type of sexual violence experienced. The majority of male rape victims (an estimated 79.3%) had only male perpetrators
I'm trying to dig deeper into the numbers and questions asked but getting server errors and getting bored with this same old mra bullshit.

If I thought of myself as a leftist, but found that I disagreed with every single thing every leftist I encountered said and that the writings of Marx and Engels drove me to spitting rage, I might at some point ask myself if I was really a leftist after all.

Especially if being a leftist required testicles, which I don't have.

Vitriol -
Look at the numbers for "forced penetration." I consider this rape - though the statistics do not because the legal definition of rape in the US also does not. So any comments about rape entirely ignore this huge chunk of people.

So we have gone from"I'm friendly, let's chat" to "I'm going to go away now because there are too many of you and I can't keep up" to

I know what you are all saying, I realise how you feel, I know what you think but fuck you, I don't care about you, I don't care about your safety, I only care about myself and my rights and what I want and me, me, ME, ME, MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

That was quick.

Crikey, so many of my friends think I'm a bigot for my views about self Id, I think I will show them this thread.

Hell, HotRocker, that's awful. . The extra level of betrayal that comes from believing someone to be your friend must have made it so much harder to deal with.

Friendly - could you stop banging the drum for male victims just for ten seconds, or start a new thread about it?

A tiny number of people think sex is a binary

My typo! :) there’s a ‘not’ in there of course ...

Sex is most definitely a binary.

My autocorrect is a sadist. As you were.

oldcrone

Yes arousal can happen in those circumstances, but also i would assume that some of those cases may be women in positions of 'power'

But its still a rarity as you say

What an excellent idea! May I suggest the thread title "Me, and why I'm more important than you"?

(Hugs), HotRocker.

I get that you automatically sympathise with the male in those situations, Friendly.

As when India Willoughby criticised Karen Ingala Smith's Counting Dead Women site for giving men a bad press. The priorities are clear.

Friendly- do you honestly think women are as much of a sexual threat to men as men are to women? Talk to women, any woman, and I guarantee you they will have experienced sexual intimidation by men, probably many times, do you really think men say the same about women?

This has been talked about on here before, and I've asked lots of people in real life.

I've only ever met one man ever who said he felt he'd been coerced into sex - and that was with his wife when he wanted the marriage over but she kept (apparently) taking her clothes off and getting into bed with him and forcing him to have sex so that he wouldn't leave.

No man, not one, has ever told me he was held down/tied up/forcibly "sheathed" or whatever.

I know lots of women don't talk about rape because they know people won't believe them, but some do. Are we really to believe that 50% of men have had this happen, but never mentioned it?

I ran the "sex is not binary" thing past DH last week and his response was "well what the fuck is it, then?". And then there was a whole evening of coding jokes, for which I blame TRAs.

MaryZ

friendly still doesn't mean I have to completely kowtow on my principles etc. I assume you think you're rather friendly too, yes? Are you kowtowing to trans people?

So why are you offended when i say exactly the same thing?

A woman would know that there is a huge, huge difference between a woman being raped, and forced envelopment.

Not just the act itself, but the violence that can go with it.

How often does a woman force a man to penetrate her and then murder him?

I'd really rather have a friendly neighborhood dog than a "friendly" neighborhood MRA...

(Luckily we have several of the former, and if there are any of the latter I've been lucky enough not to have them talk at me.)

YourFriendlyNeighbourhoodTrans

Thanks for clearing that up about arousal. I have no idea what would happen to a man's penis in such a situation. I actually went and asked my husband the question before posting , but his response was that he didn't know because it had never happened to him! I expect men vary in their responses as well, but I was expressing surprise that the a man's response to being in a terrifying situation might be to get an erection.

The difference (as I'm sure you know) between being forcibly penetrated and being forced to penetrate is that if you are raped, you do not need to be aroused, but if you are doing the penetrating with a penis, you do have to be aroused.

You will notice that I was asking a question, in the hope that someone would be able to answer it - I don't think trying to educate myself about anything should be viewed as disgusting.

Anyway, as you've read my previous post, perhaps you can stop spouting the nonsense about equal numbers.

You want to answer my first paragraph your friendly?
Best stay away from those rapey women then. Buh bye.

Oh, I don't think there is any chance at all of you kowtowing to any principles at all

I don't believe someone who comes on to a feminist discussion board and joins thread after thread to say "but what about the poor men" they are much harder done-by than mere women and (more importantly, obviously) "but what about meeeeeeeee", I'm the hardest done by of all" has any principles.

The US legal definition of rape isn’t biological-sex or body-part specific though - so women can be rapists in the US:
www.justice.gov/archives/opa/blog/updated-definition-rape

In the UK, rapists must be penis-owners, by law:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_English_law

(Although women can be accessories to rape and sentenced as though they are rapists)

‘Forced envelopment’ would be sexual assault in both countries, so really, we should be comparing serious sexual-assaults-by-women-on-men with rape to find comparable statistics in the UK.

None of this is an argument against sex seperated spaces because even if women are committing forced envelopment left right and centre, to ‘innies’ cannot do it to each other.

In order to minimise ‘forced envelopment’ a d keep dicky people safe you need to keep cunty people and dicky people apart.
Happily enough, this also minimises the risk of rape to cunty people, so win-win.

Sex segregated spaces for all.

pickleville

i think there's a lot of issues with just straight up asking people this stuff. Masculinity so fragile and all that, and a lot of men feel will likely feel that admitting something like this happened to them is unmanly.

I'm sure you've seen the stories of teachers who rape their students - look at the responses to those stories when the child is a young girl vs
a young boy. Look at the way those stories are framed.

It's always a hot teacher in a bikini photo when its a woman teacher doing the rape. It's framed as a relationship, treated like the child could consent. That they weren't using their position of power to coerce a child into sex. And the comments are sickening; with things like "lucky kid!" being all too common.

to deny that our culture plays a huge role in how open we are about talking about sexual violence is especially silly for apparent gender critical feminists.

Added to which, a person would also have to have some questionable principles in order to try to derail the PIE thread.

Not that we are allowed to conflate the two things, that would be appalling, obviously.

Crone - I did read but havent had chance to properly look at what you posted yet.

and I'm sorry if I sounded snappy there! I just often see kinda of crappy comments around this subject and I guess i let my emotions get the better of me. Again, very sorry! :)