Is it possible not to agree thatTWAW

[BertrandRussell]

ans not be transphobic? Because I think transwomen are transwomen and deserve all the rights and protections of the law, and should to live their lives peacefully, unharnessed and using any names or pronouns they wish. But I don't think they are actually, literally women. Incidentally, neither does the only transperaon I know well enough who is old enough to ask. If thinking that makes me transphobic is she transphobic too?

I don't believe trans women are women. But I fully support "real" transexuals (i.e. not beardy blokes with penises who say they are women) and would have afforded them the courtesy of preferred pronouns if it wasn't for TRAs.

I think it's absolutely possible to not believe trans women are women without being "transphobic".

Well according to Shon Faye, transwomen are shifting constellations of biological, political and cultural phenomena which varies according to context, place and time.

I think that’s quite pretty.

I think this will pass actually once the damaged people start coming forward and it becomes less attractive when people see the reality of the fact that actually nobody is attracted to trans people as sexuality is pretty much influenced by biology.

I just feel really sorry for all the people who will have had bits chopped off for no reason because they're just going to have to keep going with it.

Pratchet wtf is that photo?! Have you seriously taken a photo of a trans woman in a swimming costume? Is that not worse than upskirting?

wtf is that photo a TW not looking very humiliated in a swimming costume in a swim change
?! Have you seriously taken a photo of a trans woman in a swimming costume? no

Is that not worse than upskirting?

Maybe but it looks like a pose so I don't think they mind. I've cut the face off on purpose.

How is that were than uplifting? It's not even close.

They are posing rather proudly for a start and don't appear to be totally oblivious the picture is being taken.

No. Not even in the same league as upskirting.

*worse than upskirting

If a person can accept the phenomenon of being transgender

Wow, that’s really similar to Shon Faye’s definition, where they refer to transwomen as biological political and cultural phenomena.

FFS Pratchet if it's not your photo how do you even know it's a female changing room?
The changing table suggests unisex / disabled room.

How would you feel if that was a photo of you in a swimsuit being shared on a public forum with the intention of humiliating you?

I can still see the person's face. That has got to be the worst thing ever shared on here and that says a lot.

Pratchet do you have the person's permission to share a photo of them in a swim suit on a public forum?

Would you be happy if it was you in the picture?

I'm guessing Pratchet has probably seen it on someone's publicly viewable social media feed. I never cease to be amazed at what people will share. (Heather Peto, for instance, has put some completely eye-watering photos in the public domain, leaving me wishing there was such a thing as brain bleach.)

I'm constantly amazed by people who say they support trans rights and yet pull the faux naif stunt when it comes to what that means.

I'm guessing GC women are the only ones that get sent those kinds of photo, or who recognise it.

Oh I don't intend to humiliate. It's to show a lack of humiliation and in fact apparent enjoyment. Funny how you get so upset over this but don't give a shiney shite about the women and girls who will be faced with this in change rooms. This IS awful isn't it? Somebody was proud enough to post this pic in the internet. It's in the public domain. But YOU don't care about the women and girls facing this IN REAL LIFE while in a state of undress themselves. Look at all your fake outrage. While you DON'T CARE about the real life impact of this on women and girls.

(Heather Peto, for instance, has put some completely eye-watering photos in the public domain, leaving me wishing there was such a thing as brain bleach.)

Don't remind me.

Even if Pratchet took it from the public Facebook profile of her best friend it's still disgusting to share it on here without permission when the intention is to humiliate.

Depends on your definition of transphobic.

I believe everyone should be pretty much free to present however they like. Men in skirts and heels. Fine. Women with buzzcuts and disguised waistline. Fine.

I don't believe a man can become a woman.

Some people would say I am transphobic, others would not.

I don't really much care what pejorative a bunch of authoritarians and blue-haired nitwits have made up to describe anyone who doesn't believe in their version of Year Zero. I'd rather be called whatever is the insult du jour than submit.

Define transphobia.

At the moment some circles believe it's simply anything that they disagree with.

For a lot of critically thinking rational people, including trans people, you can say that and not be transphobic.

It a very good linguistic example of a 'thought ending cliché': a device deliberately intended to stop thinking. In this case it's also designed to force you to 'pick a side's this it's a divisive political tool too.

It's just a woman in a swimsuit, no big deal.

ITS NOT EVEN A FEMALE CHANGING ROOM - nothing to suggest from the photo that it is.

Therefore the only distaste is from seeing a trans woman in her bathers. They are allowed to go swimming as well you know.

So daim, do you believe the straight, cross dressing males with a sexual fetish, that now fall under the trans umbrella, are actually women too?

A male who presents as a man, no surgery or hormones but says they are a women? How is that trans if they are happy as a man? What makes them a woman?

TWAW is a lie nobody should be forced to say. No one is "assigned a gender at birth". SEX cannot be changed.

Here's why I just don't believe that trans women are women trapped in male bodies. We are often told to imagine how we would feel if we woke up one day in a male body as an exercise to get us to understand what it's like to be a trans woman. Wouldn't it be terrible, thinking that you're a woman but being in the 'wrong' body? The thing is, if I woke up in a male body I would immediately resign myself to the fact that I'm never going to enter female only spaces again. This would be painful, and sad - but it's not about me. You see, I have a deep appreciation of how terrifying my appearance would be to women (I've read similar things from trans men who go out of their way to avoid making women uncomfortable.) Would I demand access to women only spaces because I'm a woman with an unfortunate medical condition? No. Would I cause a massive fuss because lesbian women are no longer willing to date me? No - I'd fully understand. On holiday, would I try to enter a female only bathing area? Nope. I'd go to the mixed baths. The last thing I'd want to do is scare or discomfort other women. If trans women are women trapped in male bodies, why can't they seem to appreciate the impact their appearance has on other women?

It is totally transparent that the only thing you get upset about is XY people (who frankly here don't even look bothered) showing the reality of Self ID. This is what Self iD means NOW at Hampstead Ponds. Right NOW, thisvus what it means for women and girls. And YOU DOn'T CARE.

I think by now it is obvious that it is a matter of obeying Followers of Genderism or suffering the consequences.
The dominance/submission paradigm has always been about obedience.

That's a very good point, WeeBisom.