I find male bodies in female spaces very threatening....

[loveyouradvice]

.....it is as simple as that.

I want safe spaces where I know I can relax and know that there will not be male bodies present.... whether it is at the swimming pool, or in the ladies, or in so many situations...

And I find that in this tough world of ours in other situations I feel uplifted by being in women- only groups, nurturing, supporting, caring, sharing....

I know that many transwomen badly want to be women but the reality is that they do not have female bodies - their bodies can be very threatening, especially given so many of them do indeed keep male genitalia.

And more than that.... I feel threatened that I will lose those precious supportive women's spaces, having heard of so many others they have destroyed, whether it is Michfest or lesbian groups or even just women's groups where vulnerable women have ended up fleeing.

Is it ironic that the only sensitive transsexuals we seem to come across - the likes of Miranda Yardley et al - are quite clear that they are men and are keen to understand a "woman's lot".

I would feel far more reassured if there were transpeople who were wanting to be assimilated into a woman's world by understanding and sharing our causes, which never seems to happen and we never hear about - all we hear is of those who are closing down by demanding that trans issues are not excluded.....It feels so strange, I have never heard a woman campaigning for the end of FGM complain that it is not about them but about others....

Transwomen, if reading this makes your blood boil, then you're already the loaded gun that women fear.

Yep.

that uncertainty still applies to you even if you don't see yourself as a man actively conflicts with the individual's belief that they are a woman on some metaphysical level and should be seen as such by others.

This. In everything. Like the quote on the Pride thread from a transwoman saying why can't lesbians realise that their cock will feel qualitively different from a man's cock because they believe they are a woman on that metaphysical level.

You can believe whatever you like. Go for it. Live however makes you happy. But when you start to force, shame, bully and compel others to not only profess to believe your personal philosophy but to submit their boundaries, their sense of safety and even their bodies just to validate you - it's not inclusion, it's bloody shameful, controlling, self indulgent and abusive behaviour that no one with a brain should be indulging.

I'll tell you what I'm finding increasingly frightening - people telling me I should just accept as many male-bodied people as fancy going into the spaces in which I'm - or other women are - most vulnerable.

Just accept it, because some of them are worried about going into the men's and/or believe it's their right to be in the women's spaces.

And that includes safe spaces for girls in schools, on school trips, etc.

Bugger 'safety' and 'safeguarding', eh?

Why do we even have to justify this.

It’s the Law!!!

EA , sex protected characteristic

The trouble is, however, that this "sex protected characteristic" will mean nothing is men can self-id as women. In law, it's seen as a change of 'sex'.