Had a reply from CRUK re "cervix havers"

[ShotsFired]

(Longstanding donor, I emailed them following this article: www.thetimes.co.uk/article/smear-test-campaign-drops-the-word-woman-to-avoid-transgender-offence-263mj7f6s?shareToken=84b68d81ce844a6f55b8e64b9a36757b)

The meat of their reply as follows.

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We want to make it clear that this is not about disengaging women from the screening programme, or eradicating the word women. It’s our duty to make sure that everyone who is eligible for this screening programme knows about it. Research shows that cervical screening prevents at least 2,000 cervical cancer deaths each year in the UK so it is vital that we raise awareness that Cervical cancer develops in anyone who has a cervix.

In addition to this, screening might not be relevant for all women such as those who have had a full hysterectomy. We phrased our information on cervical screening to reflect this. Some women identify as men but still have a cervix, so we wanted to make it clear that they would still need to be aware of the screening programme.

We do always welcome feedback and so I do thank you for getting in touch. We definitely want to ensure that our messaging is as accessible as possible for lots of different audiences and do not want to discourage anyone who has cervix from the screening programme. We will make sure that’s considered for future communications.

Based on this I have now decided to withdraw my donation from CRUK and support a charity that focuses specifically on female gynae cancers instead.

"Trans women are biologically female. We just have more physical masculinities than most other women"

By biological masculinities you mean things like penis, testicles, prostate etc I assume and probably some secondary sex characteristics as well?

Actually, that's another one. We can't call them "secondary sex characteristics" any more I assume?

"What's are masculinities?"

Here is Harnaam Kaur - a woman I admire very much.

metro.co.uk/2017/08/01/bearded-lady-and-proud-bullies-told-me-to-die-because-of-my-pcos-but-now-i-love-my-look-6808201/

No, I've read that. How does the existence of disorders of sex development mean that "none of us are 100% male or female". Because I dispute that assertion.

It's a good point about the statistics @Maryzsnewaccount. I also hope that CRUK keep track like this.

It is abundantly clear what the priority is when the language they use around women's and men's cancers are so obviously different.

Omg wake what does that stuff even mean

Just well blah blah junk

Sex isn’t a spectrum wakame.

As you yesterday told women who were infertile that a transwoman was just as infertile as them, I feel that you may not be best placed to advise on gynaecological cancers either.

Sex is not a spectrum.
Everyone is Male or female.

I am deeply suspicious of any research (or maybe that should be researchers) who refer to sex "as assigned" at birth.

You don't get to assign someone's sex - it is observed. Assigned at birth is a bizarre misinterpretation of the dictionary definition of the word.

And now you seem to be asserting that human sexual dimorphism is so random and fluid that saying "women have cervixes" and "men have prostates" >> as a generalisation across the whole population >> is pointless as it will be wrong so often?

So, you want sex education and bology lessons changed?

Do you want humans to be removed from the group "mammal" or do you want the definitions of mammals changed?

Do you understand how statements like the one above, that transwomen are biologically female just with a few more "masculinities", land on a thread full of women talking about cervical cancer, and with stories of recent gynaecological surgery etc?

Is the word gynaecological OK or does that have to go as well?

I'm 100% female. I know this. Please tell me why I'm not.

Ms Kaur is a fabulous woman who has facial hair and owns it.

She is not intersex. She is not to be used as a ‘gotcha’ point. Her hirsutism is absolutely irrelevant to being transgender or intersex.

It may shock you, wakame but a significant proportion of women you see have loads of body and facia hair. Loads of it. The vast majority of them feel the patriarchal pressure to remove it, but I can assure you that many, many women are as furry as their husbands, partners etc. its normal

Research shows that cervical screening prevents at least 2,000 cervical cancer deaths each year in the UK so it is vital that we raise awareness that Cervical cancer develops in anyone who has a cervix.

^

this

is bollox.

baby girls are born with a cervix, they do not need to have smear tests.

"As you yesterday told women who were infertile that a transwoman was just as infertile as them"

Oh for fucks sake.

• of course as surgery / hormones is unrelated to trans status, many transwomen will be perfectly fertile. Not having a womb because your'e a man is not the same as a woman who has had hers surgically removed. I would hope this is obvious? Why are transwomen appropriating women's reproductive struggles / situations like this?

Madigan said as well didn't they, that they were biologically the same as a woman at a point in her cycle where she wasn't fertile

It's like Men in Black or Scientology where our bodies are just vessels for some other and separate being that is sort of driving them around.

Why are transwomen appropriating women's reproductive struggles / situations like this?

It’s distasteful isn’t it?
I would like to use stronger phrasing than that, but in the current climate, I shan’t.

"As you yesterday told women who were infertile that a transwoman was just as infertile as them,"

You are either infertile or you're not. As an infertile woman, I have an opinion on female infertility. One of those opinions is that a trans woman who is infertile, is an infertile woman.

Wakame

A question for you.

Do you think mummyoflittledragon is now not female due to her tah?

TAH stands for total abdominal hysterectomy.

Wakame

Are post menopausal women not women?

"I can assure you that many, many women are as furry as their husbands, partners etc."

I agree, but most aren't. In other words, most men grow a full beard and most women do not, and that means that beards are a sex characteristic.

Masculinity used in this context is a social construct. If having facial hair weren’t considered so “unfeminine” I’m sure a lot more of us would have a moustache. My 11 y o DD is now beginning on her lifelong struggle to remove all visible body hair because the patriarchy says girls and women don’t have body hair. I’ve tried to explain that she doesn’t need to do it, but when other kids take the piss at school and she’s seen me doing the same thing then unfortunately the cycle continues.

A woman who has the confidence to say “This Is Me” and grow her lush beard out deserves respect.

Does not make her any less a woman, as the way you dress or whether you pluck your eyebrows does not change your sex.

"I dispute that assertion."

You are welcome to dispute it.

If you discover that you are infertile due to your sperm not being high quality enough to fertilise an egg then you are not an infertile woman.

Please don’t anyone report this thread. They had the other one deleted because there was just too much common sense on it and they were obviously worried that people might read it. Can we please make sure not to say anything inflammatory and not to report any posts on here so that this can stand and people can read wakame’s posts. It’s important that this stuff is left in the public eye!

Agreed. I want anyone who's on the fence about this issue to be able to read Wakame words and learn that this is where we're headed if trans activists get what they want.

"A woman who has the confidence to say “This Is Me” and grow her lush beard out deserves respect."

Absolutely - I am a huge admirer of Harnaam.

"Does not make her any less a woman,"

You don't have to tell me that - I'm trans, so I already don't think that physical masculinities necessarily make anyone less of a woman.

We have a binary perception of a spectrum simply because most humans have most of their sex characteristics more towards one end or the other, but we are all a mixture. Harnaam happens to have one characteristic quite a way into the masculine range, but that doesn't make her a man - whether or not she, as person, is male, female or something in between is matter of identity. As far as I know, she identifies as female and that makes her female as far as I am concerned.

It kinda like they've tried super hard to only say women when they have to.

They've added wee paragraphs to include transmen. But given the vast majority of women think of themselves as women rather than cervix havers, it does look odd that you have to dig for references to women.