Very basic, obvious examples of male privilege please?

[tigersox]

Examples every man will experience. Undeniable and obvious

I'm trying to make male privilege simple to a friend who feels us feminists have gone too far.

Thanks

If we are talking about burden of proof, how about proving that male-bodied people don't pose a threat in female spaces?

"I was addressing the ridiculous claim that it is mens fault that they die whilst doing dangerous jobs."

"That hasn't been done. Screenshot please."

"95% of all work place deaths are male because many of said males DON’T FOLLOW THE SAFETY PROCEDURES!!! "

Instead of changing the subject why don't you explain why how claiming that 95% of workplace deaths being male is because men don't follow "safety procedures" isn't the same as claiming it's "mens faults"

Just admit you were wrong, or keep doubling down on your mistake. Either is fine with me

fmsfms Sat 23-Jun-18 12:52:18
"Implying that all men...
No, it isn't implied or stated. That's just your biais.

You gave women living longer than men as an example of female privilege.
No one said 'not all women live longer than men''. Because we understand the use of class.

"you blamed me for burning the dinner"

"No I didn't"

"Yes you did, you said I never read the instructions and left it in the oven for too long"

"That is not the same as blaming you"

@pratchet logic

@upstartcrow "You gave women living longer than men as an example of female privilege.
No one said 'not all women live longer than men''. Because we understand the use of class."

You've got me confused with someone else, try again

Are you feeling ok? Sorry but I haven't said anything to justify that

OK, someone else gave that as an example, and you dont hear us saying NAWLLTM because ditto.

Discussions using class are the standard on this forum, learn how to join in.
Go and google 'health and safety horror stories'' and ask yourself why so many men put profit before worker safety that we actually have to legislate for what should be human decency or common sense.

@fmsfms I'm curious. Do you think I'm lying about the alcohol and drug use on worksites? Or is it that you think I'm generalizing that men are to blame for their own deaths?

Because if it's the second, let me clarify. I think addiction is a tragedy and I would put much more money and time into helping people with it. I think foremen on sites should turn away workers under the influence and I do blame them for allowing clearly intoxicated men to work. I do blame the culture of masculinity that tells men that drinking and risky behaviour are manly. I do blame the culture of money that forces this situation. But do I blame the poor bugger who falls off scaffolding because he's high? No. That's terrible.

"95% of all work place deaths are male because many of said males DON’T FOLLOW THE SAFETY PROCEDURES!!!"

Here's a list of reasons why a worker might violate a safety protocol and not be to blame:

• they were set a task for which they were not trained and don't know they need to be trained for. e.g. not realising that you should have working at heights training to use an indoor scaffold platform in a high-ceilinged room.
• being threatened with dismissal for refusing to use unsafe equipment or refusing to work without safety measures in place.
• being misled by management as to what proper protocol is.
• being misled by peers as to what proper protocol is and management not spotting that and sorting it.
• removal of warning signs, e.g. taking the mandatory signage next to abrasive wheels down whilst the workshop wall is repainted and not putting it up again.
• management putting a faciliy into commission without all safety measures in place, like the stunning example I saw once where some labs using hydrofluoric acid had been brought into service but the red emergency telephones weren't yet cabled into the phone system.

All of these things are examples of where a worker would be working without proper safety protocols in place, all of them are not the fault of the worker but of their (mostly male) management.

By twisting Pratchet's words, you have accused her of an allegation that she never made.

That list btw is not exhaustive, it was just what I could remember from my own experiences of work.

Being believed there is something physically wrong with you if you go to the doctor with some complex symptoms, rather than being told you are anxious or have an eating disorder.

Not having to guard your drink in case you get roofied.

Not having to worry about a camera in a public toilet.
Never being the victim of an upskirt photo.
Not having porn made about you and plastered online.
Not being the victim of revenge porn.
Never having to wash spunk off your clothes after being out in public.

@MrsTerryPratchett

No, I think anecdotes aren't compelling evidence for anything

yourlogicalfallacyis.com/anecdotal

You responded to the claim that men are more likely to die at work/in workplace accidents by blaming it on them being on drugs. Your basis for this is your own anecdotal experience.

Your anecdote doesn't apply to every workplace or every workplace casualty

What is it about people with Pratchet in their names not getting this? 😆

The really simple one of thinking it is

absolutely fine to commandeer the name woman and start using single-sex spaces, without realising or caring to think about why they are single-sex and how much these spaces matter and mean to women and children who really need them

@haxxor you're missing the point

Men are more likely to die at work because they do more dangerous jobs

All the replies to this point attempt to blame it on their own incompetence or that of their male management.

None of you want to accept or admit that men are more likely to die at work because they do more dangerous jobs.

The attempts to assign blame to these men reveal your collective misandry

People die at work all the time and there are lots of reasons where nobody might be at fault e.g. It's just bad luck, but yeah keep trying to find ways to blame men 😂

Just realised all the replies are just victim blaming 😂😂😂😂

haxxor MADE the point
Not making sense there fms

There is no point talking to fms. Not even for the lurkers

My youngest son used to have Opposite Day. This is like Opposite Day and Groundhog Day together. In Wonderland.

"95% of all work place deaths are male because many of said males DON’T FOLLOW THE SAFETY PROCEDURES!!!""

Substitute workplace deaths for rapes, males for females and watch the cries of "victim blaming" pour in

Keep it up

You aren't arguing in good faith fms so it's tough to actually have the conversation. Which is an interesting conversation to have.

If you look at the majority world, the statistics aren't similar. Street sweeping, garment factories, picking rubbish, farming, prostitution if you consider it a job (I don't), open mining etc. all jobs that women do. Why did they all get safer in the Western democracies while the jobs almost solely done by men (mining, logging) stayed incredibly fatal?

Increased mechanization, unionization, safety protocols seem to be working, and observed, in some workplaces and not others. Or have we just kept the poorly paid jobs that women tend to do in the majority world and the very well-paid dangerous male jobs in the Western democracies?

The perception that bachelors are party boys who don't want to be tied down.

The perception that spinsters are sad old ladies who are left on the shelf as no one wants them.

@mrsterrypratchett this isn't an "argument", I am pointing out that posts like yours are victim blaming

What are the bad things that men do to each other in the work place that results in 95% more men dying than women?

In North America, where these stats often come from, construction workers use drugs and alcohol at an alarming rate. I worked in a homeless shelter, used as cheap accommodation for migrant construction workers, who would get good and fucking high on meth all night then go to work.

fmsfs Yes construction sites are dangerous places. Yes it is mostly men who work on them and yes they have accidents and die.
You mentioned construction workers in the middle east building stadiums and other large projects (lots of skyscrapers as well).

These men are shipped in from much poorer countries, are treated very badly, paid barely anything and nobody on this thread is blaming these men for making a very hard choice to take these jobs in order to earn a living.

BUT this thread is about male privilege, not poor migrant working conditions which I agree are terrible and should be subject to international workers rights .
SO I ask :
Who dominates the countries where this is allowed to happen ? Who runs construction companies, who are the property developers, who is making the money from all these massive projects?
What's the male / female ratio of these people ?

Saying that male privilege exists doesn't mean that all men are living much better lives than all women. Not at all, I'd argue that male privilege allows those who are in a position to do so, to exploit those who aren't, whether they be male or female.