Why is misgendering a big deal?

[FortunateCookie]

Hope someone can help because I’m really trying to understand why not affirming someone’s identity is that big of a deal.
I understand that it’s polite to go along with whatever someone’s chosen gender identity is, but I can’t believe that it’s actually a big problem if you don’t?
Surely if your friends and family accept your identity, it doesn’t matter if someone at work doesn’t?
Would it really make someone suicidal?
Do any of the trans organisations say why it is so important?
I just don’t get it.

You tell us HOW women feel, and we'll say if that applies to us.

I can't work out if the gender fundamentalists on this thread have realised their lack of logic and are desperately trying to distract us with verbal diarrhoea, or lack the mental ability to see the flaw and circularity in their reasoning.

No one identifies as a word if the word has no meaning.

You cannot possess a gender identity if there is no meaning to the word gender.

Arguments that are circular
'A woman is anyone who identifies as a woman' are without meaning and make you look thick.

Here's a very, very simple question.

Is gender a group with shared characteristics, or an individual thing that means something different to everyone?

And who has a pathological condition that they need therapy for to come to terms with the demands of others who don't give a fuck about their feelings, and who doesn't.

If you have a pathological fear of men, that's incredibly stressful for you. Therapy to lessen this fear would make you feel better. You will most likely have to interact with men throughout your life so it will be impeding social interactions and work. If it's caused by trauma, therapy help you come to terms with this.

If you are trans, the only "therapy" given is conversion therapy. Living life as your true gender will make you happy, healthier and likely to succeed, while "therapy" offered has a huge chance of making you commit suicide.

It's about what's best for the person.

Rosesandflowers

The language that you use is very telling - you assert that women who wish to access single services must have a pathological phobia of men and should access therapeutic services-

So are you saying that women who don’t wish to share their spaces with men should be educated out of this fear ?

That’s the most dangerous, sinister thing I have ever read.

Both cis and trans women have mentioned this and it's repulsive every time.

WOMEN. Not cis women. What is repulsive is calling women cis.

If you have a pathological fear of men, that's incredibly stressful for you. Therapy to lessen this fear would make you feel better. You will most likely have to interact with men throughout your life so it will be impeding social interactions and work. If it's caused by trauma, therapy help you come to terms with this.

This is it isn't it? Women in refuges, work on your fear of men. Want a female to give you a smear? You have issues and need therapy.

Fuck that shit.

Considering men abuse and assault and murder women every day (every minute of every day) I would say not wanting to be around them is a perfectly reasonable response.

I don't think you mean conversion therapy... perhaps affirmation therapy?

Considering men abuse and assault and murder women every day (every minute of every day) I would say not wanting to be around them is a perfectly reasonable response.

Absofuckinglutely. Can't even escape them or their superfans on here.

Arguments that are circular
'A woman is anyone who identifies as a woman' are without meaning and make you look thick.

This.

So are you saying that women who don’t wish to share their spaces with men should be educated out of this fear ?

Absolutely not.

In the post it was asserted that it would be a comparable situation. General discomfort is natural. It's not comparable to the excessive reactions to misgendering I was discussing.

Apologies for not making this clear.

Living life without having to pretend that men are women, without having to deal with men who are determined to take whatever they want just because they want it and who scream “TERF” at any woman who isn’t willing to act like their mummy and sacrifice her own interests to make them feel better.

That’s what would make me happy, healthier and likely to succeed.

And, to clarify, by 'excessive' I don't mean 'melodramatic'; I mean larger than the general discomfort trans people can experience at misgendering. As in actual traumatic flashbacks etc.

Absolutely not.

Apart from you absolutely did. We see this bullshit and thank goodness women can lurk and read exactly what you TRAs are trying to pull.

are you aware that among some TIM sexual harassment is a very welcome validation?
Yes - I did touch on that in my original post. The idea that they are being treated "like women" can be exhilarating above the degradation/fear of the moment. Some trans people enjoy it for sexual/validation reasons that cis (or non-trans, if that's what you prefer) women may also experience.

Don't be so patronising. You were applying your definition to anyone who isn't trans. That is wrong as has been explained to you. It's not a matter of "confusing".

Sorry if that was implied, but as I said, a genuine miscommunication. "Cis" is used only to describe those who identify as either a woman or a man and whose sex corresponds with that. People elsewhere on the gender spectrum aren't usually encompassed in this term.

If you want your handmaiden cookies that's up to you, but I am not a "cis woman". Males are not a subset of women. They are a subset of men.
Ah, of course. I'm a "handmaiden" Was waiting for that one!

Because misogynistic men are so frequently completely educated on trans rights!

I'm not on your gender spectrum. That's not something I believe in. I'm not trans.

Apart from you absolutely did. We see this bullshit and thank goodness women can lurk and read exactly what you TRAs are trying to pull.

I understand I should have made it clearer, but the post was about a comparable situation. Having traumatic flashbacks from an abusive home or conversion therapy is more comparable to an actual phobia of men, rather than just discomfort/ wanting them not to be there.

Apologies again. It was worded very poorly.

I don't think you mean conversion therapy... perhaps affirmation therapy?

No - conversion therapy is a tool used to try and literally "convert" LGBT+ teens from their identity. It's absolutely awful and I think the suicide rates are about 50%. I've read some accounts and they're heartbreaking.

Cis is only used by those deliberately trying to destroy the Meaning of the word woman.
I could trot out of my door now and ask every person I meet what Cis means and I guarantee no one would have a clue. It is a nonsense term, made up to normalise trans males as actual women. You are a hypocrite.

Was waiting for that one!

Cap fits and all that. I don't identify as a transphobe or "cis" but you have bestowed that on people here. You can call yourself a cis woman if you like, but don't arrogantly presume to apply it to me. I don't have a gender identity so I guess I'm agender.

What you stated isn't true. Trans people in the UK are not offered therapy with the aim of making them desist. Affirmation is what is done these days, unless I am mistaken? Conversion therapy is very definitely not something that any qualified psychiatrist/gender specialist would be allowed to mandate.

I think telling teenage girls that they are right in their “identity” panic to get out of girlhood and be boys, and sending them on a road to sterility and amputated breasts is “heartbreaking “

Cis is only used by those deliberately trying to destroy the Meaning of the word woman.
I could trot out of my door now and ask every person I meet what Cis means and I guarantee no one would have a clue. It is a nonsense term, made up to normalise trans males as actual women. You are a hypocrite.

I've gathered you've all got a lot of feelings about this word … so am going to stop using it. Is "non-trans" a preferable substitute?

It really just makes it a lot easier. It's a short word that can go in front to specify whether the woman is trans or not. I don't use it because I want to "destroy meanings" or offend anybody.

As for the rest of it, I don't really understand. Are you saying I'm hypocritical because I'm saying that misgendering someone can be harmful and that "cis" isn't offensive?

Yes. I think that sums it up! A man can choose how he is called (you really don't see m/nay transmen calling for men to be erased) but a woman cannot be accorded the same privilege!

And you need to remember what cis actually means - though I know you don't like words to have definitions:

Cis–trans isomerism, also known as geometric isomerism or configurational isomerism, is a term used in organic chemistry. The prefixes "cis" and "trans" are from Latin: "this side of" and "the other side of", respectively. In the context of chemistry, cis indicates that the functional groups are on the same side of the carbon chain[1] while trans conveys that functional groups are on opposing sides of the carbon chain.

It is a wholly coopted word that doesn't even have the same meaning it has been grabbed for!

No - conversion therapy is a tool used to try and literally "convert" LGBT+ teens from their identity

Now you're lumping all LGBT people into one group as if trans ideology didn't have a homophobia problem.

WOMAN Is a perfectly acceptable word, but it is amusing watching you tie yourself in knots to be seen as nice yet still not use it.

Trans people in the UK are not offered therapy with the aim of making them desist. Affirmation is what is done these days, unless I am mistaken? Conversion therapy is very definitely not something that any qualified psychiatrist/gender specialist would be allowed to mandate.

No, because it's hideous and awful and most qualified psychiatrists/gender specialists are horrified by the existence of it.

But conversion therapy is most definitely a thing. It's illegal in the UK but not everywhere.