Magdalen Berns is back!

[nolongerblue]

Hoorah!

Angry not 'special' people, just not everyone. I have a lot of friends who are women and are not trans (cis women is technically how we describe ourselves but you don't approve of that term on the boards).

Some of my friends would absolutely feel oppressed by a dress code forcing them to wear skirts/dresses or heels. They'd probably be incredibly uncomfortable and even feel anxious or depressed because of it. Some wouldn't really care either way. Some would choose to follow the dress-code even without the dress-code in place, so for them it's not an oppressive thing.

I don't think something can oppress you, if you don't feel oppressed by it, but obviously it can oppress other people.

Living in the UK, I'd back any collective campaign to stop sexist dress-codes, or anything else that helped dismantle oppression.

If I lived in the US I'd be reluctant to put my job in jeopardy unless it was becoming impossible for me personally to work under those conditions. There just aren't enough safeguards there to protect workers, and there isn't enough social security to enable people to live without a job.

I feel oppressed all day long. Like, really oppressed. May I go to the front of the queue?

Most fruit teas seem to be decaffeinated They lack any active substance; and you can tell straight off that they appear unconvincing (weird colour etc), and the aroma is misleading and leading to wrong.

Oh my goodness, someone offered me fresh nettle (of the stinging persuasion!) tea, once!

I guess I am perfectly happy acknowledging my own privilege compared to other people, and also my lack of it compared to them too.

It's not a competition, it's a way of giving others the boost they need to have a fair shot.

It's not about people being more or less important, just about them having more or less struggles based on a variety of factors, and helping everyone to get to a point of equality.

It's a shame you feel that Queer Theory turns brains to mush, I'm sure the Professors and academics who research and teach it would be so disappointed to hear that you think that. Guess their doctorates are worthless, did you want to write to the universities and tell them?

hipster what queue? You can though, doesn't bother me, it's not a competition.

Nobody seems to have said anything about the fact that American employment laws don't allow for the kind of collective and lasting change you would want. Just seems pretty crucial if you're arguing about why an American did or did not try to get that change.

loops, you do realise this system of self-assessment of struggles may be open to being gamed? What checks and balances do you propose?

You guess right.

They all know that men aren't women. But hey, queer theory 🙄

Fruit tea is so generally boring and a waste of time and money. Currently (rather than currant-ly, boom boom!!) I feel that the whole industry is somewhat up its own fundament.

It's a shame you feel that Queer Theory turns brains to mush, I'm sure the Professors and academics who research and teach it would be so disappointed to hear that you think that. Guess their doctorates are worthless, did you want to write to the universities and tell them?

They already know.

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Loops, I was a union organizer in the US for a lot of years and the kindest thing I can say to you about labor law in the US is that you are mistaken when you say American employment laws don't allow for the kind of collective and lasting change you would want.

I don't think the dysphoria argument rings true though loops because Ash has been given permission to wear suits and is choosing not to, after 4 years of conformity. If it was really causing intense distress, not sure you'd choose to continue.

I don't know anything about Ash. This is my first encounter but one of my bug bears is the amount of projection and assumption that happens - particularly from older trans identified people towards young people. I just don't like to see similar going back the other way. The only sentence that really jarred with me was trans doesn't exist. I just don't think that's actually true.

They already know

Trans people exist. Trans as in 'born in the wrong body' not only doesn't exist, it logically can't, unless you are a person of faith that believes in souls which have sexes.

They already know

I meant to say lol!

Queer theory?

Personally I believe souls don't have sex or gender. Everything is energy and oneness...

But I can see the difference between me, who grew up thinking that boys were better than girls to the extent that I wore boys clothes and liked being mistaken for a boy but turned out to be happy in my female body; and someone that is desperately unhappy in their body and believes they need to change it.

I'm scared that kids like I was might think that they're trans and do irreversible damage to themselves before they've accepted who they are. The umbrella is widening far too much to scoop up those with normal adolescent confusion or internalised homophobia. I'm very concerned about that.

But I do believe that there are people for whom their dysphoria is a very real and valid condition that they cannot just snap out of. Whatever the psychological or biological drivers are for that condition, it exists.

There aren't enough eyes to roll

That's sex dysphoria. It's a condition that needs robust mental health support.

Eye rolling wasn't at you, Cisters

I thought it might be at my spiritual beliefs... that's a whole other thread, and not in FWR!!

The part about dissociation doesn't ring true either. Ever met anyone who dissociates? It's not the kind of thing that can happen on the regular in a customer facing job and not result in the person suffering from it losing that job.

It has been my observation that grifters embellish their bona fides as they go along the martyrs road.

The mind frankly boggles on the ends of two stalks.

I've read this whole thread through. It was most entertaining and enlightening.

My main takeaway apart from those gems highlighted by the usual stalwarts, is that Ash totally lacks critical analysis.

Even if it was true that American workers are little more than slaves in the latest episode of a Handmaids tale, why did Ash have to think to her sweet little self "I'm not taking this shit any more. Why is this dress code being forced on MEEEEEEEE. Oh I see those CISmen over there, they don't have to wear heels. How trans misogynistic is that!"
I can see the suffering etched on her face not. The ciswomen at her workplace probably have bunions, corns, varicose veins, prolapsed wombs from multiple childbirth...
I had to laugh at the idea that a bunch of actual women call themselves ciswomen. What clowns.

Nothing loops says makes any sense. Breasts don't cause dysphoria FFS. Patriarchy causes it.

Well said!

I call bullshit on the whole story. I think Ash made the nonsense about uniforms up entirely so she could make a video, corporate jobs in the U.S. don't typically require uniforms. My first job was in customer service for a corporation 25 years ago. Women were required to dress professionally but trousers and flat shoes were perfectly acceptable. I have never worked in any corporate office that required women to wear dresses and heels.

The only part I find plausible is her coming out to HR. I've worked in HR and I imagine there was lots of eye rolling when they got her email. In my office we'd joke about red flagging her file like we did about anyone who was high maintenance and might be looking for a reason to sue.

I do love Magdalene though.