Dare to hope

[Imnobody4]

Most positive thing I've seen for a very long time.

www.politicshome.com/news/uk/home-affairs/law/house/house-magazine/95277/gavin-shuker-organised-sexual-exploitation

I'd be more impressed by these pimp&punter apologists if they ever came up with sensible, workable alternatives for tackling the exploitation and abuse (mostly by men) of vulnerable people (mostly women) 'sex workers'.

It is still disturbing when clearly pro-sex-slavery posts are deleted.
Frankly, I would rather they stand. Onlookers can judge for themselves as to which side has merit.

I hate the swiss-cheese moderation. It does suck.

Yes - I would favour the insertion of a comment from MNHQ rather than deletion in some cases. Something along the lines of 'this post has been reported. It breaks talk guidelines/is not in the spirit of MN (as apt). It is being allowed to stand so that the poster's position in this discussion remains clear.'

Would something like that work?

I agree, actually, LaSqrrl - it does rather look like I'm arguing in a vacuum now I very rarely report posts for this reason.

I assume goprawny was a PBU - unusual to delete all posts like that though. Obviously, he has abhorrent pro-punter views... but he didn't say anything to break guidelines.

Oh that Keith Vaz thing

What he was recorded saying about the young man who was going to be bought to him - that he would "break him in" I think it was - was utterly repulisve and sounded extremely abusive.

And what did we get from our beloved Labour leader? "It's a personal matter". No it fucking isn't. It's not a personal matter at all when a man who pays for sex and is recorded referring to "breaking in" a man , is chairing a committee on prostitution! He has a massive undeclared interest.

I just googled to check that quote was right and can't find it. All I can find is pink news + a load of other publications saying how sorry they feel for him. I find it mind boggling TBH.

goprawns views were abhorrent, and offensive about women - no idea why MN deleted all the posts, maybe (hopefully) because MNHQ believe women are worth more than the attitudes goprawn voices.

I mean, if Twitter delete GC views as transphobic, then MN should delete views which are anti-women. There is free speech and there is hate speech. The idea that women’s bodies are a tradable commodity is hateful to women.

The deletions may have been on the grounds of being goady and inflammatory in the context of this thread, whether or not they broke any other specific talk guidelines.

I always liked the fairly light hand MNHQ used here in Feminism. I understand why they are a little heaved now but if there is so much deletion, a message on the thread would be nice.

Heavier not heaved

The hundreds of prostitutes who have contributed to threads on Mumsnet

?? I only ever seem to see the punters.

prawny's a punter - already banned by MN, or all their posts wouldn't be deleted like that - they all make the same arguments. Dull, easily de-bunked, misogynistic, and that a certain section of women should be made available for the paying punter.

I think we may have seen zurich before too.

The hundreds of prostitutes who have contributed to threads on Mumsnet and who almost without exception reject the Nordic model are either male fantasists

There have been former workers who have argued for the Nordic model.

Remind me again who uses gaslighting...

In fact I remember one self-professed "happy hooker" who favoured the Swedish model for economic reasons! She said she'd worked in many countries, some with complete criminalisation, some with full decrim, and her earnings dropped through the floor in the latter because she had to compete with trafficked women.

In fact I remember one self-professed "happy hooker" who favoured the Swedish model for economic reasons!

Yes I remember her.

We did have the late Laura Lee and another pro prostitution poster on the same thread. I can't remember the latter's name other than the thread had them playing out their own personal spat. (To be fair to Laura she remained polite to everyone unlike the other poster)

Not hundreds then - 130. (Did you count? ) Since 2009.

I've been on MN for years. We can name change.

A really good barometer for helping victims in prostitution is to look at trafficking. I think we all agree sex trafficking is a bad thing for society and individuals. As the proponents of the Nordic model say - we're in this for the voiceless victims of trafficking, not the Belle de Jours.

The Nordic model prevents and reduces trafficking - by reducing the demand for prostitutes (threat of arrest can, I think, dampen an eager punter's ardour) and the traffickers aren't interested in providing services where there is a risk the buyers will be arrested and they won't get their money.

Traffickers want legalised prostitution - which is a good enough reason in itself to not allow it.

Oh god, I've just remembered - Zurich is the creepy poster who keeps a detailed spreadsheet (or similar) of every single thread about sex work, and every single post within them by prostitutes, and trots them out to bolster his argument.

My creep-o-meter had already pinged with the receipt of the PM, but it's just rocketed off the scale.

I thought he'd been banned.

Ugh - really? Creepy as fuck.

Zurich is the creepy poster who keeps a detailed spreadsheet (or similar) of every single thread about sex work, and every single post within them by prostitutes, and trots them out to bolster his argument.

Eeeeeeuuuuuuwwwwww.