Trans women

[Jamiem80]

Probably going to get shot down massively here but a simple question clearly there is a lot of hate for men wanting to be women, but nothing about women becoming men. Do you also frown upon this or is it ok and for what reason?

That's a fair point. I was looking at these statistics.

"According to the National Center for Health Statistics, the annual murder rate for Americans ages 15 to 34 is about one in 12,000. But an investigationby the news organization Mic found that for black transgender women in the same age group, the rate was one in 2,600."
mic.com/unerased

And yes it's all tragic of course.

What's the rate for black men, SMG?

Thank you Eresh

Supermatch: not a neutral source. Can you link to the official stats if you have that link.

Black men are not black women.

I don't have US official stats no. When you say not a neutral source you mean not a source that you agree with? Not a source that is trying to improve the lives of trans people?

They are the stats I referred to. It's difficult to estimate due to under reporting and defining what is a 'transgender woman' and it is likely the number has not been yet accurately established.

I also said you had a fair point. You then try to pursue me back into the same argument to entrench me further into an exaggerated position that you then will be able to demonstrably take apart. This is a tactic you do that I am becoming aware of. Not such the rookie now.

Nor are black trans identified males. You can think what you want, in your head, of course.

Are there any stats for murdered female prostitutes in America?

Of course, it would be more..honest to compare the rates with other black men. But I do think that the high rates of prostitution among trans people is very likely to be why the rates are so high. Prostitution is a notoriously dangerous job. I would be surprised if more transwomen prostitutes were murdered than female prostitutes. Feels a bit..ghoulish to be discussing murder rates like this. I am comforted by the fact that in the UK, murders are much more rare. And transactivists in this country should be very comforted by the fact that its really really rare for transpeople to get murdered here, infact its more likely for transwomen to be murderers than be murdered. I find it slightly dodgy how whenever its brought up that the UK is extremely safe for transpeople, it gets turned back to the murder rates in America. Almost like some people WANT transpeople to think that its dangerous for them here

Almost like some people WANT transpeople to think that its dangerous for them here

Yes. They should be glad it isn't true!

www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/missouri-leads-nation-in-black-homicide-rate-study-finds/article_3b9b6d47-1764-55ae-b399-d8565d0c2fc3.html

Here are some stats on US murder rates - black men are the group most likely to be murdered and most likely murder weapon is gun, however it varies a lot by area.

No stats on prostitites and not clear that any conclusions can be drawn that have significance for U.K.

It is also a newspaper report so I so don’t know if anything has been lost in translation.

Basically all you can say is ‘hmm’.

Particularly in a week with another mass school shooting.

You will note of course in your quest for accuracy how much larger the dogs are than than the fox supermatch.

Here is the author, Margaret Atwood, explaining the circumstance that prompted to oft quoted comparison.

" I asked a male friend of mine. (I love that wonderful rhetorical device, "a male friend of mine." It's often used by female journalists when they want to say something particularly bitchy but don't want to be held responsible for it themselves. It also lets people know that you do have male friends, that you aren't one of those fire-breathing mythical monsters, The Radical Feminists, who walk around with little pairs of scissors and kick men in the shins if they open doors for you. "A male friend of mine" also gives — let us admit it — a certain weight to the opinions expressed.) So this male friend of mine, who does by the way exist, conveniently entered into the following dialogue. "I mean," I said, "men are bigger, most of the time, they can run faster, strangle better, and they have on the average a lot more money and power." "They're afraid women will laugh at them," he said. "Undercut their world view." Then I asked some women students in a quickie poetry seminar I was giving, "Why do women feel threatened by men?" "They're afraid of being killed," they said."

You will find that a male cuts the risk of being murdered by transitioning

I've always been skeptical of this. I don't think that transitioning reduces risk, I think that on average the men who transition have a lower risk to start with (compared to men in general). My guess is that white middle class men are over over-represented in transwomen. And have less need to be exposed to additional risk factors.

I've always been skeptical of this. I don't think that transitioning reduces risk, I think that on average the men who transition have a lower risk to start with (compared to men in general). My guess is that white middle class men are over over-represented in transwomen. And have less need to be exposed to additional risk factors.

Yes, this is a good point. Without the nuance, you can make these statistics say anything. Like transactivists do.

I think that on average the men who transition have a lower risk to start with (compared to men in general). My guess is that white middle class men are over over-represented in transwomen. And have less need to be exposed to additional risk factors.

But some of the 'gay male transitioners' from lower socio economic status would not be at less risk compared to men in general. But it could explain why black trans women are over represented in the statistics compared to white, yes.

SMG certainly spends a lot of time worrying about males.

Nauticant: I agree stats schmats but
What if

If it were a specially low risk group, then the risk level of the rest of the men would rise when they left it

Surely this is true. Happy to be corrected (always)

SMG certainly spends a lot of time worrying about males.

Trans women are not males LaS

Toe jam is jam.jpg

Trans women are not males La

They absolutely are. Every single one.

Potatoes are not toes.

Actually, it my comment was more about when you brought up male victimisation rates for murder as some kind of... point?

But of course you then went back to TWAW.

So yes, that is why I used the word 'males' in my comment. A check of the DNA will prove that statement correct. TWANW

Earwigs ARE wigs!

Under Birds Eye.

Trans women are not males

That's not what quite a few transwomen who've posted on MN say.