Channel 4's Genderquake Debate is heavily criticised/ boycotted(?) by prominent transgender activists & allies .

[R0wantrees]

Transgender campaigners and organisations have released an open letter to Channel 4 criticising Genderquake, a season of programmes touted as an exploration of the gender debate, as "counterproductive".
Signees are particularly concerned about Genderquake: The Debate, a studio discussion hosted by Cathy Newman that promises to look at what gender means in 2018. It will discuss topics including: 'what defines our gender identity', 'how that affects our rights', 'should it be easier to change gender' and 'does gender matter'.

The letter, published by indy100 in full below, argues that the debate will give legitimacy to transphobia, prejudice and the notion that trans identities are up for discussion. This concern is presumably stoked by the presence of Australian-born academic and writer Germaine Greer on the panel, who has previously said transgender women "can't be women". continues...

"The letter is published in full below and has been signed by dozens of prominent transgender and non-binary activists and campaigners - and allies - alike, including Fox Fisher, Owl, Stephanie Hirst, Juno Roche, Travis Alabanza, Kate Llewellyn, Jack Monroe and India Willoughby."

www.indy100.com/article/genderquake-the-debate-transphobia-channel-4-open-letter-campaigners-germaine-greer-8341481

Agree.

Greymisty blimey that is so shockingly horrible. That is something that really needs addressing not Transwomen feeling abused by having the word penis shouted at them

TwittleBee and Greymisty

Exactly. I wish a woman, any woman, would get the chance to say that. Double the already high risk of being sexually assaulted if you're disabled. That's abuse. Not having the word penis shouted out loud in a crowded auditorium.

Ffs.

And I also agree with Lang. People in real life are not going to buy this. People whose livelihood does not depend upon courting public opinion. Or playing both sides against the middle whilst trying to keep their own hands clean.

Most people do not feel an overwhelming need to pander to identity politics.

People in real life are not going to buy this.

That's OK so long as these people have a say in the law being changed and in implementation of changes by organisations. So far, I can't shake off the feeling that a great deal is going on that's being done in ways to bypass these people.

The solution for that would normally be the media but for this issue, the media largely seem to be on-board in not letting these people know what's happening/intended.

Trans Media Watch response to Gender Quake Debate.

recent thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3238618-Trans-Media-Watch-has-written-to-parliament-saying-trans-identified-male-can-be-considered-as-hate-speech-and-that-Mumsnet-users-referring-to-penises-are-being-transphobic

I've not watched it yet but saw this on twitter; a break down of who, what, interruptions etc. Sarah came of incredibly badly with time talked over and interruptions.

twitter.com/gabcsika_me/status/994220006325080066?s=21

For ease of viewing:

It was very badly organised and I cringed watching. What a shame as it seems a good opportunity was wasted.

Really interesting stats, thanks to the woman who compiled them and you for sharing Ekphrasis :)

It peaked my sister. Normal people just won't buy the whole sex is socially constructed BS. If they are truly shown the depth of this debate I think they'd be outraged. It's worded in such a way that Munroe saying 'not centering the womb as the iconography of womenhood' doesn't make people realise they're really telling women to stop talking about their bodies. These things matter to women.

Then I showed her Magdalen Berns video and explained Cotton-celing. That works well. I think this issue is really good because it destroys the 'transwomen as victims' motif' How do we get this discussed? I think many straight women feel instinctively protective of lesbians when they hear about it - they get it.

those are interesting to look at!

That's OK so long as these people have a say in the law being changed and in implementation of changes by organisations. So far, I can't shake off the feeling that a great deal is going on that's being done in ways to bypass these people.

I agree. It can sometimes feel frightening. And I'm not dismissing that, at all. I waiver.

But the Tories have kicked it into the long grass for now. And that was before women really got their teeth into it.

It feels to me a little bit like something that is time sensitive. Because, each day, more and more women wake up to this.

I think it was quite significant that the only two trans people they could get were Bergdorf and Jenner.

Neither of them have any credibility with the general public.

Most transactivists are refusing, now, to go on air. Using the bullshit excuse that they won't debate their existence. That's going to get very old, very quickly.

All these mantras run out of steam, because they are never backed up with anything.

Organisations are lagging behind the debate. Just on the basis that most people don't understand it, and aren't aware of it properly.

Lobby groups get in first, and get it nailed down.

The only way to change that is with more debates like this. It's becoming increasingly more evident that women are not getting their say.

Most transactivists are refusing, now, to go on air. Using the bullshit excuse that they won't debate their existence. That's going to get very old, very quickly.

Then we have the debate without them.

That's OK so long as these people have a say in the law being changed and in implementation of changes by organisations. So far, I can't shake off the feeling that a great deal is going on that's being done in ways to bypass these people.

You're right. And I think the likelihood is that we'll get a lot further down this road before public perception reaches a critical mass - at which point, we will have a grassroots political revolt to rival Brexit.

It would be better if we could raise consciousness now, so that as little damage is done to as many groups as possible - but it's hard when you're being gaslit by the entire liberal establishment. Very annoying when you're on the left, as I am!

C4 from the word go were after sensationalism and controversy. That's what c4 does.

I think they got the debate they wanted.

I don't believe you can win an argument with "no debate" though if you are wanting to change people's minds.
Not all millenials want 101 different pronouns and blue hair. It's like punk in the 1970s (but less interesting and no music) only a handful of people were really punks the rest of use just got on with life and did a bit of pogo dancing.

If C4 get enough stick for programmes on the trans debate they may decide to change tack and do a series on feminism instead. At least then one group of people will be on side. We could give them a list of awesome women to invite. GG could speak properly. They could all speak for 5-10 min uninterrupted then debate or do audience questions.

You don't need a debate if you live in an autocracy. This won't be debated they'll just try to sneak it through Parliament and hope nobody notices. We don't live in a democracy anymore. It's a sock puppet neo-liberal punch and judy show.

That would be great.

Put people around a table and have a proper debate, that's what's needed. If people could talk without being shouted over or belittled it would achieve a lot more than the program last night.

And get a better, more impartial presenter than Newman and present it in a balanced way without stacking the deck.

And get a better, more impartial presenter than Newman and present it in a balanced way without stacking the deck.

YES!

they may decide to change tack and do a series on feminism instead.

I'd love this to be true but C4's attitude to trans ideology vs feminism makes it clear who has privilege and speaks to the shallow and exploitative sensationalist capitalism of reality tv. I look at this lot and I can't help but be reminded of the vulgar narcissists in the Capitol of the Hunger Games, they are the target market for this telly trash. If only more of these woke young people could see the connection.

The last thing mainstream media wants is for people to hear the common sense and empathy of real feminists talking about women's human rights. It is completely to their own interests.

Opposed to their interests, sorry.

Twittlebee and Datun I used to have to know the stats for work...if you research it good chance you'll end up in tears if you have any empathy at all. Can't get reliable stastics because some woman literally can't speak due to physical disabilities, some women with mental health or learning disabilities are told their making up fairy tales if they do - it is literally a living nightmare. Or should that be literal violence? And that's not looking at the evidence of DV home violence where some woman who can speak choose not to because the abuser is the carer and the woman knows care homes can be (not all care homes) just as bad...or worse because it's abuse in an institution and then where do you turn if that happens?

For clarity the estimate of 1 in 2.5 is across all different disabilties, living both in a care setting and a home.

The TRAs can sod off with most vulnerable in society bs, they get stastics (that they can manipulate) disabled women don't even get that. Being upset with a heckle at a debate? Now thats a privilege!