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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

MNHQ Deletion Policy

935 replies

TheUterati · 30/04/2018 17:03

Earlier today the Trans Park Run thread was deleted in its entirety because SOME posts alleging cheating were deemed to be 'not in the spirit' of MN.

We have a thread about that running.

I have just been deleted on the Heather Peto thread for posting this:

"Bless..."

A post intended to be mildly dismissive.

That was deleted for breaking talk guidelines.

Give me a fucking break MNHQ.

"Bless..." gets a deletion!??!?!

TRA really have got you on a short chain, haven't they?

OP posts:
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OlennasWimple · 30/04/2018 18:56

IWill - I report transphobic posts. The ones that actually are transphobic or particularly rude or belittling towards trans people. Funny thing is, these are only ever (that I can recall) made by non-regulars on the FWR board. Regular posters on here might disagree with trans ideology, but it's only if you get into the rabbit hole of biology is bigotry (there is no such thing as a female penis!!) that you see much transphobia on this board

And FWIW I would never report patronising or sarcastic posts, or MNHQ would be completely swamped

Bless!

IWillReportAllTransphobicPosts · 30/04/2018 18:57

Yes changey I will agree that there needs to be a way to distinguish between transwomen and women. Society already has a way to do this.

Transwoman/Woman

Can you see the difference?

There is no need and it’s very hurtful to a trans woman to remind her that she wasn’t born the way she felt. Ie:calling her a male in any way.

I’m pretty sure from discussions with the few people who do know and the trans support forums I am on that most people know the difference between a trans woman and a trans man.

It seems like some people here just like to stick the boot in.

OlennasWimple · 30/04/2018 18:58

James Dean and Robert Redford

AngryAttackKittens · 30/04/2018 18:58

It's just such a shallow way of looking at womanhood, prettiness and making other girls jealous. I'd be raising my eyebrows at anyone who said those sorts of things in a feminist space.

AnnUnderTheFryingPan · 30/04/2018 18:58

Why spend so much time arguing and shutting people who disagree down as ‘transphobic’?

Surely you can use your time and energy campaigning for trans people, ensuring they get the support they need (which, I suspect will
Be taken away if Self Id comes into play).

Shouts of ‘transphobia’ simply alienate those who would naturally be allies and supporters. The TRAs and MRAs are doing a cracking job at this.

Isn’t there a better way IWill?

AngryAttackKittens · 30/04/2018 18:59

Beautiful men are a wonderful thing! They're still men though, regardless of how lovely their faces may be.

LangCleg · 30/04/2018 19:06

Aaaaand back on topic...

... it seems to me that there have been some deletions today that are alarmingly autocratic. If deletions are being made not solely on the basis of content but also on the basis of how much external ire they attract, could I reiterate the suggestion for training in managing coercive control?

AssignedPuuurfectAtBirth · 30/04/2018 19:06

Oh the best comparison ever.....

"Are you being forced to wear a seatbelt in a car"

You are 'forced' to wear a seatbelt for your own safety. And if you are in the back seat then for your safety and that of front passesnger.
(so that you don't doff them in the back of the head in a crash. Fancy that)

Forcing someone to tell factual lies is totalitarianism

SonicVersusGynaephobia · 30/04/2018 19:07

Can't believe RefuseToDenounceBiology's post was deleted. Basic biology now gets deleted? It wasn't transphobic, it wasn't goady, it wasn't about any particular transwoman.

Sort it out, HQ.

ScrappyScrap · 30/04/2018 19:07

Who I choose to have sex with is quite frankly none of your business scrappy
Confused, surely the answer is that genitals don't matter? Confused I didn't ask who you want to have sex with, I asked if genitals matter.

Surely a transman can have a super manly body by your definition.

AssignedPuuurfectAtBirth · 30/04/2018 19:07

I just went out for a walk with the dog and all hell broke loose

AssignedPuuurfectAtBirth · 30/04/2018 19:09

Ewww to the 'friends being jealous' bollocks. Such a high opinion of women

AngryAttackKittens · 30/04/2018 19:11

it seems to me that there have been some deletions today that are alarmingly autocratic. If deletions are being made not solely on the basis of content but also on the basis of how much external ire they attract, could I reiterate the suggestion for training in managing coercive control?

Agreed. Deleting anything that someone complains about is not a very sophisticated way of handling moderation, especially if the fact that your site is currently under attack by a specific group of activists and you are very well aware of that is taken into account. There also seems to be a substantial difference in what gets deleted based on which moderator handles it, and that's also likely to lead to confusion and erode goodwill from the userbase.

Terfragette69 · 30/04/2018 19:11

This is just so disturbing. We are losing our last sanctuary due to the fact that some do not recognise science and biology. To the poster with a trans daughter I feel for you I really do, I cannot imagine what that was like for your family but its not just about you, or your child.... Do you not see that? Do you think it's okay that we have to change our language, so as not to offend trans women? Or do you agree that women should be punched or attacked for questioning? Do you know about the wider implications for women and girls??

Ellenripleysalienbaby · 30/04/2018 19:12

Iwill what exactly is it that makes your daughter a woman, and more specifically 'more womanly' than you?

Can you give a definition of woman for us?

MissTeri · 30/04/2018 19:14

I'd be extremely pissed off if someone said someone who is biologically male is more 'womanly' than I am. It's akin to a white person claiming to be more black than a black person.

TeamOrders · 30/04/2018 19:19

Can't believe RefuseToDenounceBiology's post was deleted. Basic biology now gets deleted? It wasn't transphobic, it wasn't goady, it wasn't about any particular transwoman

Sort it out, HQ

100% this. What's going on, have we been invaded by goady fuckers AND is there a TRA plant modding the board? It's absolutely unacceptable here today. Fucking 'bless'!!!

LangCleg · 30/04/2018 19:19

Deleting anything that someone complains about is not a very sophisticated way of handling moderation, especially if the fact that your site is currently under attack by a specific group of activists and you are very well aware of that is taken into account. There also seems to be a substantial difference in what gets deleted based on which moderator handles it, and that's also likely to lead to confusion and erode goodwill from the userbase.

Something is going wrong.

And I am not being partisan when I say that I think Mumsnet would do well to invest in some specific training for when the problems moderating a community come from outside the community. I think the gender critical posts others find to be transphobic should be allowed to stand but I also think the pro-TRA ones that others find to be sexist/misogynist should be allowed to stand - within the usual reasonableness test, of course.

But you can't apply different standards of reasonableness because you encounter more hostility or intolerance for speech and opinion from one side than another.

SupermatchGame · 30/04/2018 19:20

LangCleg ... it seems to me that there have been some deletions today that are alarmingly autocratic. If deletions are being made not solely on the basis of content but also on the basis of how much external ire they attract, could I reiterate the suggestion for training in managing coercive control?

I think the deletions have been very considered, fair and pragmatic.

Is your repeated suggestion, again and again, that Mumsnet employees undergo training of your choosing in itself coercive? Might some people experience it as coercive? Are you aware of what training they may have had?

AngryAttackKittens · 30/04/2018 19:22

@MNHQ, I just received a rather odd personal message from a commenter whose name I don't recognize. Can you clarify who has access to our private messages and exactly what information about users moderators still have access to?

ErrolTheDragon · 30/04/2018 19:23

I think the deletions have been very considered, fair and pragmatic

Even the 'bless' and 'yawn'? Thank goodness no-one dropped a Biscuit.

0phelia · 30/04/2018 19:24

It's quite disturbing and offensive to women that the marker of "womanly" amounts to making friends jealous for being pretty.

And how on earth is any woman "more womanly" then another without resorting to bullshit stereotypes?

Ereshkigal · 30/04/2018 19:26

I think the deletions have been very considered, fair and pragmatic.

You would, wouldn't you? That's what's known as "cognitive bias".

RefuseToDenounceBiology · 30/04/2018 19:26

@MNHQ seriously sort it out.

Rufustheconstantreindeer · 30/04/2018 19:29

I think the deletions have been very considered, fair and pragmatic

Deleting posts such as

'Bless'

'Yawn'

And 'rufus who?' (Changed the name Wink)

Is very considered, fair and pragmatic?

Alrighty then