Excellent article on the problem of transphobia

[crispbuttyfan]

www.huckmagazine.com/perspectives/opinion-perspectives/mumsnet-transphobia-online/

"Regardless of intention, it seems to me that Mumsnet has allowed transphobia to become associated with their brand through their inaction. These boards have now become nothing short of echo chambers, spaces in which anti-trans rhetoric is continually employed with little objection."

The evidence is apparent throughout the feminism board.
Where lies are spread with abandon and the truth is slandered as 'gaslighting'.

Everyone who can politely and eloquently point out that they are proequality for all and on mumsnet to talk about women's rights. And really value advertisers who support the site which offers freedom of speech to do so.

Might want to let the advertisers @ in by the person commenting on that tweeted article here:

mobile.twitter.com/L_12345ac/status/990912206358372352

OMG that's exactly it with the gate keeping thing... But I kinda agree with you certain things like sport age of transition must obviously be taken into account even my friends agree with that but not all this calling all trans women men or violent or rapists I just don't get it any valid discussions seem drowned out by all this transphobia.

What you said was that it was 'madness to pretend there isn't a female biological component to their existence.'

I took that to mean you thought there WAS a female component to their existence.

Did you mean something else?

Mumtobe25, I am sure your friend is very nice and all and in a lot of cases it doesn't matter whether they are male or female. But in certain areas it does matter: toilets, especially for minors, hospital wards, prisons, healthcare, sports. Biology matters. It is not fair to demand (and not ask) if women want to share hard won rights and spaces.

One of the many things we need to learn from the past is that women have it ok now. Yes, with all the sexism, metoo, silencing and ignoring womens voices, it actually used to be even worse. Even worse. Would you like a say, Mumtobe25, to have a voice in legislation that will effect you? In healthcare, education, safe spaces if you ever need them? I know I do, but the current legislation for self id is being pushed through with no debate, no questions asked and little to no risk analysis.

Yes the transwomen I know have had to go for breast exams gynecology exams they are at risk from most female related conditions they have the exact same blood as me and can have those off days when a dosage is mixed up a component of trans women's existence is female Imo at least

not all this calling all trans women men or violent or rapists I just don't get it any valid discussions seem drowned out by all this transphobia

I see lot's of people making this accusation, but I've not seen it happening anywhere.Where have you seen it? Or have people just told you this and you are repeating it?

FermatsTheorem to be honest you're one of the only people I've felt comfortable talking to I feel like everyone else is trying to change my opinion on the GRA and trans people like I'm not allowed to believe trans people are what they transition to. I hope there are more like you in the future but I don't like this I just wanted to say to trans people that might be reading they're welcome here and I'm sure they'll make great parents one day that's it. and all this Idk maybe I should have just stuck with that because I want mums net to be trans friendly.

How the giddy heck do you have a gynaecology exam when you don't have anything gynaecological?

What on earth are 'most female related conditions' if not those related to female biology, the uterus, the vagina, ovarian cancer, pregnancy etc?

It doesn't make any sense to call male problems female.

You can be friendly without trying to believe the impossible, surely?

I've been posting on Mumsnet for a number of years and peaked about a year ago. I don't normally use this username for gender critical posts but I don't think I will go back to my gender critical username because after i was routinely scoffing at all the articles that said that Mumsnet is transphobic I actually felt that elements of the parkrun thread was transphobic and i was disappointed at the responses it had from most posters. A few people were throwing around accusations of anyone disagreeing as being a tra or a man. I am neither.

In case you haven't read it, the background is that a female poster didn't like the fact that she was "beaten" by a trans woman in a parkrun. Parkrun is an event where the main ethos of the company running the event is not that it's inclusive, non competitive, welcome to everyone of all fitness levels to encourage people to exercise. The idea is that you are supposed to compete against yourself and yet lots of posters felt that this person running as a woman (when park run ask for gender and not sex. There are no rules about what category you have to put yourself into in order to run in this event) was completely beyond the pale and quite a few people said some unpleasant things about transpeople.

Lots of posters say that normal trans women going about their lives are not the problem and it's the trans rights activists that are the problem, but then on that thread a transwoman going about her life and not having any direct impact on women or threatening the safety of anyone is a massive issue. Which rather shows up the statement that Mumsnet has no problem with trans women who are just living day to day minding their own business, to be a lie.

I am as gender critical as the next person and I think that Society would be improved no end if we lost gender stereotypes altogether and I do not agree with the tra position or trans ideology, but that doesn't mean that a trans woman going about her life shouldn't be afforded respect when she's having no impact on anyone else. It's completely different if it was a competition but parkrun is not. If you treat the small stuff as though it is JUST as important as the big stuff then how are you going to get anyone to pay attention?

the transwomen I know have had to go for breast exams gynecology exams they are at risk from most female related conditions they have the exact same blood as me
Erm no they don't.
If they have a constructed vagina - they do have to have it examined (I assume) but it isn't a gynaecology exam. They cannot get cervical cancer, as they don't have a cervix. I'm not sure what other gynae exams you are talking about? Apart from those during pregnancy (which again, not going to happen) and those relating to infertility (you can't look inside a womb that isn't there) I am drawing a blank.

Men can get breast cancer, men have breasts. I imagine if you are taking a load of female hormones, then yes, your risk of breast cancer will be increased beyond your average man. But the amount of breast tissue will still be smaller than most women and examining your breasts is going to be a bit different. In the UK (are you in the UK?) having a breast exam from a doctor is not a "thing" though regular mammograms are usually suggested for women over a certain age, and as I say I imagine that taking loads of female hormones might increase this risk.

Women and men do not "have the same blood". For a start, women who menstruate have a higher risk of anaemia. Women can't give blood as often because of this. The chromosomes in the white blood cells are different as we women have XX and men have XY. I am not a haematologist but I suspect someone who was could go on.

Yes the transwomen I know have had to go for breast exams gynecology exams they are at risk from most female related conditions.

Both males and females can be affected by breast cancer. No issue there. It’s rarer in males but it happens.

have the exact same blood as me and can have those off days when a dosage is mixed up a component of trans women's existence is female Imo

I’m not quite sure what this sentence means. Male and female blood isn’t particularly different however a trans woman does not have the organs required to do gynaecology on. ‘female complaints’ like endometriosis, periods pains, vaginismus etc are physically impossible for a trans woman to experience.

Do you believe that humans can physically change sex? I don’t mean take on the appearance of the opposite or have surgery/ appearance altering activities to appear more like the opposite sex, I mean actually change sex?

I mean why is everyone jumping down my throat just for being welcoming to trans people, to me they're my sisters, I welcome them and I'd like this transphobic association with mums net to come to and end. So I guess I'll just say it again and sign off here I've babbled enough anyway

"if you're reading this I believe you are what you've percevired to become I recognize your struggle and if your worried about being a good mum or dad don't be MN will help you out and you'll always be welcome here at mumsnet"

It's completely different if it was a competition but parkrun is not.

No, not a competition at all.

Nothing to see here.

This is not the parkrun page you are looking for.

Their gynecological exams are different but they still need them I don't pry too much and yes to an extent I believe trans men and women do change their sex thats the whole point of hormones but what do I know I just studied biology at uni for 4 years and teach it.

This is what confuses me.
Saying we welcome transwomen into most women's spaces, but that biology is different - how is that transphobic?

It's as if saying that people whose origins are in Africa have a higher rate of sickle cell anaemia suddenly was racist?
Whereas in fact, Nigerian friends have told me when you meet a new partner and get serious, you check if they and you carry the trait, in case you want to go on and have babies. It's that common and that much a part of society.

Surely people want to have good medical care based on being informed about their own individual biology?

@Mumtobe25 no one is jumping down your throat. If you post things that are just not correct, people will respond and point this out.

How are they gynaecological exams at all?

I just studied biology at uni for 4 years and teach it

Gosh, if true, that's scary.
Do they change their chromosomes, in your understanding?

*But that doesn't change the fact that I believe certain spaces and activities should be single sex, because there are a small number of circumstances (less than 1% of my daily life) where biological sex matters. My non-negotiable list is women's prisons, women's communal changing rooms, women's rape crisis centres, women's domestic violence and homeless shelters, and women's sport.

The rest of life - meh, knock yourself out. I don't care how you dress, what you call yourself. I want you generic you) to find housing, jobs, live free from harrassment and hte threat of violence, have all the same human rights as the rest of us.

But not women's rights, because when you dig down (reproductive rights, right to free assembly away from the threat of male violence, rights which protect our employment against threats to it due to childbearing) - all specifically women's rights have their roots in biology.*

From what I have read on here, this ^^ is a pretty good summary of most poster's position.

bold fail and apostrophe fail - posters' position.

No they don’t need gynaecological exams. The entire field of gynaecology is aimed at organs they do not possess.

Humans can’t change sex. They can alter their hormones but that does not change your sex. It can alter your appearance, and give you all manner of health problems but sex is built into the body from conception, at a genetic level. Nothing can change it.

Do you actually teach biology in the UK? Where did you graduate from, out of interest?

No their transcriptome changes

@Mumtobe25 I am amazed that you have a degree in biology and you teach it as well. But you seem to have less understanding of biology than I do with my C at O Level. I worry about the quality of education available nowadays. It is not possible to change your biological sex and we should not be telling children that it is.

Permanently or only while on hormones?

I'm guessing from the description of the medical exams, and the fact that she says she studied for 4 years, that it was the US. Though it could be Scotland, I don't think "breast exams" are the norm there either.