The Lib Dem LGBT twitter feed is annoyed at Mumsnet

[yetanothertranswoman]

Apparently the Alt-Right and 4-Chan are using MN.
I think it's just one person who controls their tweets. I really hope that the top Lib Dems know what's being said.

RedToothBrush

I agree that a push to form alliances is going to leave a lot of people a little suspicious.

There are, indeed, many feminist groups which anyone can support already, who have a coherent strategy and a track record.

Many, if not most, people have to be incredibly circumspect about this issue. Both with their personal details and identity, and also having what they say open to scrutiny.

Assuming everyone thinks the same as oneself is a mistake.

Understanding that you can find common ground, despite thinking differently about many details, is necessary. But it doesn't immediately lend itself to an alliance.

@RedToothBrush I hope you're okay. Generally, I mean.

You have a fantastic strategy and highly relevant political knowledge. Coupled with personal experience of this it issue. That combination has to be unusual, if not unique.

Your stresses are going to be amplified by conflicts.

You have my support, whatever you decide to do. And gratitude for what you have already done.

You have my support, whatever you decide to do. And gratitude for what you have already done.

This. Red your posts have been consistently excellent, informed and thought provoking and I realise it must take a toll on you.

FWIW I took a break from FWR a while back when I thought that the forum had become more about winning on ideological grounds and ideological purity (you are with us or against us) than it was about nuanced debate and allowing for multiple positions within the gender critical spectrum. It all felt like the left I ran away from in the 80s.

Adding my voice to this @RedToothBrush

You have my support, whatever you decide to do. And gratitude for what you have already done

Re this thread - the LibDems are clearly washing their hands on this issue and won't be getting my subs, assistance or vote again. Politically adrift again, I wonder where we'll end up.

I was member of the Lib Dems for a long time post Blair/Iraq. I'm genuinely saddened they've taken the stance that they have on the sexist, horrible-to-women-for-being-women tweets.

I'm also disappointed at the Pastoral Care Officer's role in this 'washing of hands'. That's the opposite of what Helena Morrissey recommended the post should achieve :(

All very best wishes, Red. You've opened my eyes to a lot of stuff.

Let's not fight each other. If some one wants to join this group, they can, however I am very concerned about being outed so I am doing what I can on my own and think that lots of other people feel the same.
The term 'pile on' is not the worst I've ever heard. I'm glad that people are emailing these companies.

@RedToothBrush - if you need a break, take one. I'm another one who would like to thank you for so many insightful posts on here. You've been inspirational and informative and I'm grateful to you.

@RedToothBrush

I too would like to say thank you for all your thoughtful and well researched posts.

As a political issue, i find Self ID incredibly threatening and consequently incredibly stressful to deal with. I have been a political activist, off and on, for many years and I've never experienced anything like it.

I take breaks from it all from time to time as well, for my own well being.

Do look after yourself and take some time away if you think it might help.

Okay this has derailed massively since yesterday.

But on my small part I emailed a number of prominent Women and the Diversity person in the Lib Dems. Raising my concern about the criticism in this thread and elsewhere.

And so far have received one considered reply. Which actually contains in it the true reason that some of you may feel unlistened to and fobbed off.

"Party HQ simply does not have any resources to keep up with the fast moving social media world in which we live, and with the best will in the world, no one from HQ will ever have time to read Mumsnet. I think we employ one single person on the social media side of campaigning. This does, unfortunately, leave a gap - which others rush to fill. I can only say that I do believe that this is a minority, albeit a vociferous one, and I hope that it is - and will continue to become - less and less prevalent in the party and that we will become much more diverse."

Which is the nub of the situation. The Lib Dems may have a large number of members now, but doesn't have many resources compared to Labour (union backing) or the Conservatives (wealthy backers and businesses). It doesn't have a large head office.

In fact the same issues are likely for any new "centrist" party and even I suspect for Macrons En Marche.
Without a huge party machinery, most things are carried out by willing volunteers. This means that any new member does have the chance to make a change, but also that not every message is tightly centrally controlled.

If those of you who are Lib Dems tear up your cards and leave then the party won't change. If you fight within the party then maybe change will happen. The Women's group seems a bit dead at present, but it could be re-invigorated to provide a check and balance to the group controlling LGBT+.

Thanks for that post @Bekabeech it makes sense. The Lib Dems are a relatively small and (in my experience as a member) not very well organised party. I still haven't received a response to my complaint, however I grouped it in with another complaint about sexism from a local councillor so I'm hoping the delay responding to me is them looking into that!

The Women's group seems a bit dead at present, but it could be re-invigorated to provide a check and balance to the group controlling LGBT+.

I found much of interest in the response from that LD person Bekabeech, but for the mo one question:

Is there a Lib Dem women's group? I just assumed they didn't have one. Do you know how to get in touch with them?

I'll join.

(BTW also to red, and all of us battling away alone or in groups)

LD membership is in excess of 100000 AFAIK - more than Conservatives. Local organisation has generally been good.

Also pleased to see you lot giving your council candidates some valuable feedback- my experience so far is that party members and most volunteers are fairly oblivious to any of this ”official” lib dem position.

Incidentally as we are in a campaign period use of the Lib dem brand assets is closely controlled. I imagine though that the twitter account got permission an age ago and is now assumed to be fighting for naice diversity stuff so they can say what they want. You'd think a number of complaints would make someone pay attention, but we'll see...

www.libdemwomen.org.uk/about

There is a Lib Dem Women group it has the same status as the LGBT+ one. Email: [email protected] Website: www.libdemwomen.org.uk/

I joined fairly recently having come across them at an event.

Superb - thank you both. I assumed it'd be some facebook thingy so didn't even bother to google.

Any other mumsnetter LDs fancy joining? It does look like it's infrequently updated.

I've voted LibDem my whole life but feel disinclined to continue doing so.
I had a dismissive reply from my letter to my LibDem MP about my concerns about proposed changes to the GRA.

I feel like there's a vacuum being created here. Not Labour. Never Conservatives. Not even Greens. So who now?

"There's lots of people, heavily involved in the Lib Dems but not part of a certain group or groupings who have had no idea of what is being said in their name. There had been no big debate about Self ID - just a small group of people who have taken it upon themselves to decide what the policy should be and an incompetent leadership group who have put zero critical thinking into dealing with it. They've outsourced policy on it to an SAO who have then silenced or bullied anybody who had suggested that Self ID might conflict with women's rights."

I think this is true and accurate and I think it is the same situation in Labour, Cons and Greens tbh. A couple of loud people with lots of time on their hands pushing policy in an area most people have little experience or knowledge of, then crying bigot and transphobia if anyone ask questions.

I think this has been deliberately coordinated and that these few people have influence over and contact with each other across their parties. It is a big scam and they get away with it because politics is male dominated and those men just don't give much of a shit about women.

RosenbergW - so right!

The Lib Dems have always had a problem with women. I remember being told by a fellow activist that we didn't need to do anything about the lack of female MPs because it would just increase exponentially & naturally! 6 years later there were no female MPs!! And that was the only reason AWS shortlists came in - because they were shamed into it - political expediency. Oh the hand wringing over all those lost opportunities for men!

The left are no better - the most sexist men I know are Labour supporters.

At least the Tories make no pretence about their sexism.

This is a marginal issue, that must people haven't heard of be Shaw it has no impact on men! That's it!

Not long after posting that I hadn't had a response, I got a response!
It just said "your complaint is being passed to the local party" so no mention of my concerns about the LGBT+ twitter account and I doubt the local party is going to address that! Hopefully they'll do something about their councillors comments about there being no glass ceiling for women though (it's just a limit to women's ambitions according to him!)

The Lib Dems have always had a problem with women. I remember being told by a fellow activist that we didn't need to do anything about the lack of female MPs because it would just increase exponentially & naturally!

Sorry but you really can't extrapolate from one Lib Dem to the party as a whole, it is much more than the other parties a place where if you get 5 members in a room you have 5 opinions.

Also I do think/hope things are changing. The membership has doubled - and I don't think "the men in grey suits" quite know what that will mean. And the women like Layla Moran certainly know how much it has to change (and poor Layla represents much of the diversity of the party).

But I do think "Headquarters" is creaking at the knees.

Bekabeech

I was using an example, from one of the hundreds I have, from over 20 years membership & activism in the Lib Dems.