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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

I don’t like the term “peak trans”

398 replies

Amoregentlemanlikemanner · 20/02/2018 21:44

I mean I get it. But I think your term should be peak TRA.

“Peak- “ is, as I understand it, a reference to the term “ peak oil” with all the connotations of the amount of oil reducing down to nothing.

Which is not, I hope, the way anyone feels about trans people.

Just my take on things

OP posts:
Ouchbirthhurted · 20/02/2018 23:50

Funny just saw a Madigan tweet about peak trans being something to do with oil and thought it odd as have never heard any connection and it made little sense. Then came in here and saw this tweet.

Given Madigan uses TERF a lot to describe anyone who doesn't agree with him on trans issues. Trans organisations have said it's fine to punch TERFs. I think if Madigan has concerns about language use amongst women Madigan could show great leadership as women's officer by stopping using ithis term which is being used to excuse and invite violence against women by extremists.

OlennasWimple · 20/02/2018 23:53

I like mashed Hass avocado on toast with slices of Choquette avocado on top (with salt - have to have salt)

Am I bi-avocado-ist? Avocado-queer?

AngryAttackKittens · 20/02/2018 23:55

Avocado-fluid. Which is different to whatever unholy thing Lang's DH is doing with his blender in the early hours of the morning.

PositivelyPERF · 20/02/2018 23:59

OlennasWimple 😂

PositivelyPERF · 21/02/2018 00:01

I’m so glad this thread has went in such a sensible direction. Avocado lovers rights are important too. Munch Real Avocados.

AngryAttackKittens · 21/02/2018 00:04

I feel like diverting to a more fun topic might actually be a great way to deal with sealions and TRAs going forward. If they then want to go ahead and report us to mumsnet, well, have fun turning "she kept making silly jokes about random food items/whatever" into an actionable complaint.

thebewilderness · 21/02/2018 00:07

I agree with you entirely AAK!

PositivelyPERF · 21/02/2018 00:07

Was that what we were doing AngryAttackKittens? 😇

Juzza12 · 21/02/2018 00:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LightofaSilveryMoon · 21/02/2018 00:18

sweet silverskin pickled onions

sweet silverskin pickled onions??!! What??!!

Acchchchchchhch! Heresy.

Get thee behind me Satan! (I'm not being personal here, though, I hope you understand.)

TheLastMermaid · 21/02/2018 00:22

Assuming you haven't left, OP, I was simply letting you know that I hadn't heard of the oil connotation. I thought it might be helpful for you to know that many of us hadn't; just as it's helpful to me to have been alerted to your meaning. Now I will be aware that it might be thought of that way.

Also, before you dismiss my contribution as irrelevant because you assume anyone not agreeing with you is uneducated, I am educated (post doctoral in Science area) and have been involved in areas of environmental campaigning myself since the 80's. Don't assume. You might allow yourself to become more informed too.

PositivelyPERF · 21/02/2018 00:32

You might allow yourself to become more informed too more chance of the op wanting to learn about avocados I’m afraid.

PositivelyPERF · 21/02/2018 00:34

I haven’t had sweet silver skinned pickled onions for years. Used to love them.

womanhuman · 21/02/2018 00:42

I have never seen a non-Hass avocado. Am I avocado shopping wrong? (And have I just pissed of 51% of avocados by calling them non-Hass? Ciscados, maybe?)

Datun · 21/02/2018 00:47

Never heard of the oil connection.

It's meant to denote the top, the apex where your credulity is finally overwhelmed by the fuckwittery.

It's really not confined to mumsnet. Lol.

It's a common expression, used all over social media.

There are several websites entirely devoted to it.

Lily Madigan seems to be incandescent with rage, increasing with each furious post.

They, and the OP, might have a bit of trouble convincing the tens of thousands of people who talk about peak trans that they are discussing oil.

Littebird · 21/02/2018 00:52

I was part of the team who formulated the Original Gender Recognition act in 2004 , The legislation was specifically written so the rights of the many men and women who had transitioned decades ago could live their lives in peace
The Original act was also written so it didnt take anything from anyone else

I campaigned ,to deliberately embarrass Tony Blair so that women like me might be able to bring a rape charge , I was raped in 1991 in my 30,s the male rapist didnt know my past then or now ! I have lived privately without revealing my past before I was 17 and commenced transition

the police warned me if I tried to do anything it would be me who would be ridiculed ,

the rapist went on to rape two , Real women “ as some of you like to insist without knowing me , or any of the other women like me who aren't noticeable , being any different to any other female

What some fail to realise , quite a number of are born in the Intersex category ,we had to be treated at the same clinics some of us were born neither male or female to begin with
so we had no other choice many of us transitioned at 18 had our surgery's and got on with our lives without causing any upset to anyone else (in my case 42 years ago ) I havent committed any crimes, beat anyone , or abused anyone either

most of us lost all our family s , most of us have lived quite fulfilling lives , brought up children , and some of us have lived next door to everyone else without ever mentioning our past , unless someone is suggesting I wear a symbol on my clothes every time I leave the house ? As that's what it sound like to me ?

am afraid most of us old people are furious at the proposed self identifiers , they are not like us ! We are doing everything we can to stop these people from self identifying

we were made to jump though various hoops 30 and 40 years ago , we also had to humiliate ourselves many years after we had thought the nightmares we lived with as children had been forgotten

in 2005 to apply for our gender to be recognised, I had to unearth letters from Drs surgeons some long since passed away, or retired , opening up some very old wounds

it didmt change my life , after all the years away from my family my mum finally made contact ,I met her , for the first time

she suggested I apply for my amended birth certificate , as she wanted to see me married

the galling thing is reading all these awful threads , and how much hate that appears to be directed at me personally , which I am sure its not

so please put yourself in my place Its a bit like Saying all women on here are the same as Myra Hindley , clearly you are not
me and my friends just want to live our retirement without any fuss
we are equally sick of hearing all this nonsense everywhere from what appears to be some very violent men pretending to be something they never will be

this is the first time in 43 years I have said any of this

OlennasWimple · 21/02/2018 00:57

womanhuman - I wouldn't worry, Hass are the best. Though your dietary preferences are probably avocadophobic if you would only consider eating Hass Wink

(I don't live in the UK - non-Hass avocados are cheaper and bigger here, they just don't taste as nice and don't mash well)

OlennasWimple · 21/02/2018 01:02

Littlebird - x-post. Sorry. I don't want you to think that my response to yours was a joke about avocados Flowers

we are equally sick of hearing all this nonsense everywhere from what appears to be some very violent men pretending to be something they never will be

This is the key thing. No-one on here has said that all transwomen are rapists or dangerous. We are saying that self-ID puts everyone at risk including those who transitioned and want to just get on with life.

thebewilderness · 21/02/2018 01:08

3rd rule of misogyny: Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.

GreenbackBoogy · 21/02/2018 01:09

To peak means to reach your maximum, to have had enough, to have had it to your limit.

Datun · 21/02/2018 01:10

Littlebird

If you have read the threads, you will know that we are not tarring all transwomen with the same brush.

And I t's certainly not women who have brought this issue up. We have been sharing our bathrooms quite happily with transsexuals for decades.

Self ID is a ridiculous and dangerous solution to a non-problem. Which will only benefit misogynistic men.

As for the rest. Transactivists are exploiting the equality law in every possible way they can dream up.

Going out of their way to target women.

It's not that we can't put ourselves in your place. It's gone beyond that, I'm afraid.

If we could turn back time, we would. All of us.

This is a deliberate, direct attack on women and their rights, scant as they are.

This conflict was brought to us, and despite the best will in the world, there's nothing we can do but engage.

Your ire, disappointment and upset should be directed at the people who have caused this.
Because it certainly isn't women.

You have my every sympathy for the position transactivists have placed you in.

Genuinely. It's shit.

Littebird · 21/02/2018 01:19

OlennasWimple, I do have a sense of humour

but you have missed the entire point , I haven't identified as anything other than what everyone just takes me for which is a woman for 4 decades

someone who wet the bed as a kid doesn't have to tell everyone that or wear a badge,

under the original act once a GR Cert is issued we are legally female for all purposes, and the same of people who went the opposite direction
sUrely it isn't necessary to use those labels after all these years ?

checkpotatoes · 21/02/2018 01:20

I always took it that peak trans was an expression that came originally from peak oil. I agree it can have negative connotations, but at the same time I think the slightly different way it's used now is here to stay. (I think some people have been a bit quick to roll their eyes at the OP and take the piss though, perhaps because they didn't themselves realise the origin of the term?)

Littlebird, it really isn't you or people like you that feminists here have a problem with - the problem is with self-id. I'm really sorry that the activists that have pushed all this are causing distress to people like you, too. I also appreciate that the comments here must seem harsh at times and as though they are directed at you or people like you even when they're not.

LittlePaintBox · 21/02/2018 01:22

Funny just saw a Madigan tweet about peak trans being something to do with oil and thought it odd as have never heard any connection and it made little sense. Then came in here and saw this tweet.

Quite the coincidence! Hmm

I've never heard of peak oil, but I've peak transed about six times now. It's like when you get to what you thought was the top of the hill, but when you do, there's still more to climb. Even though you're exhausted.

Oddly enough, the Guardian managed to miss out peak trans in their long list of peaks.

AngryAttackKittens · 21/02/2018 01:28

I do have a problem with the idea that once a certain number of years have passed a person's history and biology no longer matter, actually. Don't have an issue with people doing what they felt they had to do to survive, but if the demand is that we pretend that a trans woman is exactly the same as an adult female human X years after transition and stop talking about the differences then no, I won't do that, because it's absolutely vital to retain the ability to discuss women as a class and our biology is the root of our oppression.