Transgender woman sues over ordeal in male prison

[SimonBridges]

www.theguardian.com/society/2018/jan/20/tara-hudson-transgender-prisoner-sues-government?CMP=twt_gu

While I don't think that men with working penises have a place in a woman's prison, and I have no idea on this persons penis status, I think that putting someone who looks like this in a male prison is just asking for trouble.

And I would feel less bothered about someone groping my breasts if they were just dead bags of artificial silicone - rather than tender flesh and blood glands I have for feeding babies.

Hudson also alleges that an inmate groped her breasts and genitals, leaving her “threatened, distressed and humiliated

Hands up all women who haven’t ever been touched when you don’t want to be?

Anyone?

No. Welcome to the reality of being a woman Tara.

hahaha well quite, randoms feeling you up is par for the course. Plenty of record of female inmates in all sorts of institutions around the world and forever being subjected to sexual violence.

Oh and the other thing.

On another thread someone just said "transwomen are women" but how would someone who believes that they are literally women, so Tara is a woman same as any other woman, square that with their own description of themselves as a "she male" for escort work purposes?

Why is the first ID more valid than the second?

hahaha well quite, randoms feeling you up is par for the course. Plenty of record of female inmates in all sorts of institutions around the world and forever being subjected to sexual violence.

Oh and the other thing.

On another thread someone just said "transwomen are women" but how would someone who believes that they are literally women, so Tara is a woman same as any other woman, square that with their own description of themselves as a "she male" for escort work purposes?

Why is the first ID more valid than the second?

I have reconstructed breasts for medical reasons, I wouldn't be any less distressed about having them groped than I was before surgery. Anyone having their body groped in any circumstances is not ok and it needs to be far less normalised and accepted than it currently is.

Putting someone with breasts in a male prison is asking for trouble. That does not make Tara a woman or mean they should be in a female prison either. I don't agree with anyone having lesser rights to privacy, dignity, feeling safe and being free from assault, no matter what the circumstances. Third and trans specific space needed, that is the only way to provide it for all without anyone having to accept substandard rights.

Or is "shemale" a standard female / woman / girl thing to be now?

A six foot two bruiser who headbutts bar staff isn't suddenly far more vulnerable than other vulnerable male prisoners, just through having implants.

I am sorry about your surgery and I think if I had had necessary medical breast surgery and reconstruction I might feel even more defensive about my breasts than I do now.
But I don't believe a man would feel the same though.

Certainly not a man who has had them put there for his own sexual kink. Which he has because otherwise why is is a major part of his sex work?

I wonder if the 'need' to be in a women's prison is in fact an attempt to avoid prison altogether.

Claiming it's not safe in a men's prison, knowing that a women's prison is not suitable, hoping to be sent home with an ankle tag instead.

I really do believe that Tara would be at risk in a male prison, same as lots of other GNC men, but given that men seem to see woman often as nothing more than a set of body parts, I think having those implants would be a problem.

However, Tara also shouldn't be in a women's prison, at least not mixing with the general population. Whether Tara is personally a risk or not - it's the prinsciple - do we allow people with working dicks in women's prisons? Do we allow men in if they say they are women? There needs to be a line and it is a complex issue but women must be protected - women in prison are a very vulnerable group and they are getting no mention in this. It's all about the men.

They would also know Tara was a sex worker etc I don't think it would be right or reasonable to put Tara with the men.

Would a pre-op no hormones transman be put in a mens prison, even if they wanted? Of course they wouldn't for obvious reasons.

The issue here is not who is what and dicks and stuff but male violence - that is what needs tackling and then everything else gets better. Men need to step up here. They won't though will they, as it suits them to put GNC men in with the woman, given that they of all people are extremely wed to gender roles and ideas around what a man is, and what a man isn't.

As with all things it is easier to treat the symptom with a quick fix, no thought of the consequences and women don't really matter anyway, than tackle the root cause.

Loads of men are at risk in men's prisons, that's why there are certain areas for people who need protection.

Surprised there are not more Anti Terfs on this thread. Amazing how quiet they go when a case like this hits the headlines.

Glittery "Third and trans specific space needed, that is the only way to provide it for all without anyone having to accept substandard rights."

the problem there will be like the problems we have now with other spaces - there are many transgender individuals who don't want separate spaces, they want to go into the space where they want to go and will say the authorities are prejudiced against them if they are told to go in trans spaces.

Not long ago you would have been put on some sort of register if you campaigned to get men into women's prisons, hospital wards etc yet now if you're against it you're a bigot

There's a powerful whiff of PIE type infiltration about all this.

Please someone who thinks there needs to be special wings/prisons/etc for trans prisoners with implants .....

Can you explain why they need their own wing more than gay men, pretty boys, disabled men, bookish men, men who can be extorted, men with a nervous disposition, men with learning disabilities, men who have lost their penis in an accident, etc?

Why do a pair of implants trump all of the other male vulnerabilities to the extent they need their own wing or prison? Please, please explain.

That's exactly it @GuardianLions. There is already protection for vulnerable prisoners in men's prisons.

@GuardianLions "Why do a pair of implants trump all of the other male vulnerabilities to the extent they need their own wing or prison?"

where's the "like" button?

Why hasn't there been a trans man who has sued the MoJ because he didn't get to go to a male prison?

both
I felt like I was starting to lose my mind

Hudson also alleges that an inmate groped her breasts and genitals, leaving her “threatened, distressed and humiliated

Well alleges. Innocent until proven guilty.

And what was Hudson wearing at the time?

Well if they behaved properly they wouldn't be in prison!!

I posted a video upthread about how transwomen or 'titty girls' have such high status in American prisons, even over openly gay men who can get people killed for disrespecting them, that I imagine Tara, being used to prostitution as a she-male could really work the system and come out on top.

'Sex-work as usual' on the inside..

It wouldn't surprise me if this is considered as a reason to separate transwomen who have worked in the sex industry from the main population.