Wrong side of history

[LyraPotter]

Here is something I know to be true: those campaigning against trans rights will fail. Your money will be raised and spent and wasted. Your legal challenges will not succeed. Your relentless attempts to do injustice will fail. You are on the wrong side of history. Your children will grow up knowing better than you. You cannot stop progress. Your efforts are in vain.

And every time I'm proven right - every time a court judgment goes against you and every time a law protecting trans men and women is passed and every time equality is further enshrined in the laws of this country I am going to return to this thread for the pure and petty purpose of telling you I TOLD YOU SO.

I was thinking about that exact scene when I donated, popchyk

Being so tragically old and irrelevant also means one has many, many cultural references to draw on. It's great, really.

Why are trans activists always so ageist?

The best you can hope for is the circle-jerk you're having in this thread because out there in the real world you're losing and you know it. That's my whole point! It doesn't matter how self-congratulatory and smug you are on your tiny corner of the internet because The. World. Has. Moved. On. Without. You. And no amount of £5 donations and online posturing on your part can turn back the wheels of progress. You've lost this battle and those of us who are progressive and open minded and who want nothing less than absolute equality for all are just waiting for you to realise it.

circle-jerk.

Definitely a bloke.

The best you can hope for is the circle-jerk you're having in this thread because out there in the real world you're losing and you know it. That's my whole point! It doesn't matter how self-congratulatory and smug you are on your tiny corner of the internet because The. World. Has. Moved. On. Without. You. And no amount of £5 donations and online posturing on your part can turn back the wheels of progress. You've lost this battle and those of us who are progressive and open minded and who want nothing less than absolute equality for all are just waiting for you to realise it.

If you thought the battle had already been lost why are you bleating on about it? Surely if you thought everyone truly believed the mantra then you would have nothing to worry about. You seem rattled, I wonder why?

circle-jerk

Said no woman - ever.

lyra what are you talking about?
You sound like some kind of trans brexiteer "you are going to lose, get over it!"
What were you hoping to achieve with this thread?

More terfs fighting male supremacy, this time from Iran.

Now its illegal to be gay in Iran. They are given the 'choice' to transition or face the death penalty.
Thats because Iran doesnt have any human rights or Equality legislation.

You've lost this battle and those of us who are progressive and open minded and who want nothing less than absolute equality for all are just waiting for you to realise it.

Seriously, in what way are trans people not equal to any other human in this country? What rights do you think they should have that they currently don't have? Please engage.

Lyra love! I want equality for all! Equality would be marvellous. But that doesn’t mean pretending black is white or penises female.
TWs are our equals! They’re just not indistinguishable from women. That’s all.

Lyra, can you help me understand what rights currently aren’t available to trans people? I can’t think of anything other than being able to use spaces which are segregated by sex for reasons of safety? And none of the arguments to change that make sense, either for women or transwomen.

Donkey’s post above is the best thing I’ve read today, truly beautifully worded

@Donkey, wonderful post.

I think 13 grand raised over a weekend is happening very much in the real world, Lyra, pet. It's not really a tiny corner of the internet, is it?

Are you aware of badly your evident ageism sits against your claim of being progressive, open minded and the champion of the underdog?

If there is such a thing as looking back and seeing oneself on "the wrong side of history", you might one day, when you're older yourself, understand how painfully, badly wrong headed you turned out to be on the topic of getting older.

Lyra, to quote Miranda Yardley ...sometimes treating everyone equally is the most unfair thing you can do.

Bless you Lyra

Absolute equality as far as you see it, doesn't seem to include actual women in your eyes does it?

Back to the drawing board love.

How do women circle jerk? Do we each hold each others vibrators? Bit weird, I prefer a nice knitting circle myself.

That twitter thread from the man who accepts trans women as women apart from for relationship purposes

ie 'I accept trans women as women unless it's going to personally impact me in anyway' - I think if he manages to pull his head out of his arsehole and peer through the myopia of his own misogyny he might notice that his stance is not dissimilar to those he calls bigots. He is a terf, and should probably die in a fire - why has no one told him this?

As a short (technically average height for his time) not so great and massively overrated man once said, 'history is a set of lies agreed upon.' therefore if we're on the 'wrong side of history'...that means we're the ones telling the truth?
Being on the right side of Biology would seem to back that theory up.

Lol @ Lyra thinking she (or he) is progressive and open minded.

But some of the shouters don’t want equality - they want more, everything, to put down and lessen the value of the thing they actually aspire to (actual, genuine, original-and-best-women). Very odd logic.

what rights currently aren’t available to trans people?

FtM trans are not allowed to inherit peerages, I believe. Because when it comes down to brass tacks, those in power understand that, a) you can't change sex, b) trans may be adopted as an opportunistic label for personal benefit.

Another fiver donated, Lyra.

I'm glad you're happy about that, but frankly, it's not for you. It's for my daughters.

Excellent post Donkey.

The thing is, you can laugh at 13k, but 13k being raised in a couple of days with a not-very-well publicised gofundme account... I'm sorry but we aren't a minority.

If history judges us then the future is full of authoritarian morons who are still seeking to oppress women. Fuck 'em.

Ooh Icantreach

Hope you're not being terfy

FtM trans are not allowed to inherit peerages, I believe.

True, but MtFs are (presumably because lots of toffs enjoy wearing their wife's knickers and can see a time when this might impact them.)

So sadly - it's a women's rights issue not a trans one. I can't imagine TRAs want to touch this one with a ten foot lady penis

It always tickles me when a poster rocks up who so obviously thinks that MN is populated by BORING OLD MUMSY TYPES WHO KNOW NOTHING

It's just such an...adolescent...view. Mums can't be anything except mums. We're all, "you're not going out like that, young lady", and "have you done your homework?", and "Is your room tidy?" and we have crap hair and bad taste in music, everything we know came from the 70s, and we're just embarrassing anachronisms.

It's almost hilariously ignorant.

Distaff - I’d forgotten about that, underlines the issue neatly doesn’t it

trans may be adopted as an opportunistic label for personal benefit.

But notably, only when women do it.

How do women circle jerk? Do we each hold each others vibrators? Bit weird, I prefer a nice knitting circle myself.