Does anyone feel the need to reclaim femnism.....?

[BertrandRussell]

So many important issues just seem to be falling by the wayside. When did we last have any sort of discussion about reproductive rights in US? The Million Woman March-remember that? Weinstein and the follow up? FGM? The abortion debate in Ireland?

It's just a in joke, aluner. Some very goady posters a few days ago concluded their runs of posting by saying they had to go and make or ice a cake. That's all. It's just a coincidence that you've now said it. Enjoy your baking!

That was the most bizarre attempt at derailing I've ever seen.
Or a spectacular misunderstanding. Hmmm.

And I am trying to understand why a slur is wrong in one context, but okay in another. Why its wrong if the woman is bi, but justifiable otherwise. Or why its okay to defend using it, but not okay to question its use."

It's justifiable if a woman regardless of sexuality serenade or collides with misogyny. It is not judtifiable if it is used to descrbe a roman who is bisexual.

Of course it's OK to question using it. Just as OK as it is to defend using it. Both opinions need to be backed up.

The cake thing is just a silly joke.

Bisexual romans?

I'm full of the cold and hopped up on NightNurse, but has this thread gone weird or what?

Oh gosh Guardian, I hope you didn't interpret my post as attempted tone-policing! Use whatever you like and I'll fight to the death your right to do so (or something like that) - I was just saying why I'd started tone-policing myself

Iirc most Romans were bisexual. Or was that Greeks?

Back to the OP, yes feminism (and general progress in a way) has been derailed somewhat by the whole trans debate, at a time when funding is being cut for DV refuges, reproductive rights are under attack and cuts are hitting women disproportionately.

If i were a conspiracy theorist ....

It was very successful derailing. If you look back at the first post and where the thread could have gone.

I've been trying to understand what a sea lion is for a week or two. I think I get it now maybe?

"Bisexual romans?"

Oops.....

Ironically, (again) I am making a chicken pie as I post......

Yes, certain, I think along with the non existent handmaidens and the bisexual romans we also have a sea lion.

And now I'm in the mood for cake.

But returning to the point, I think it helps to see it all as part of a backlash, which happens periodically to feminism. Women make ground, Teh Patriarchy panics, pushes back with available weaponry. Twas ever thus.

Hi Bertrand I'm just reading through the thread. I started lurking round the feminist board because the victim blaming on the main boards was becoming batshit. The trans issue then opened my eyes to a lot of other stuff and I realised what I considered basic common sense others considered radical feminism. I.e. I always thought that prostituted woman deserved respect and support and the pimps and johns should be viewed as the scum they. I understand from this board that I support the Nordic model but bizarrely amnesty don't?

Anyway got a few questions? I haven't read the handmaids tale, who were the handmaids and why is it used as an insult?

Could somebody please explain 1st wave/2nd wave/3rd wave/4th wave/intersectional to me? (I strongly suspect intersectional is bollocks) I just want all woman worldwide to have the same rights as men, their choices respected, bodily autonomy. But I don't think equality necessarily means exactly the same, there are biological differences. I think anybody with privilege should be advocating for those further down the pike. Could someone please tell me what I should be identifying as and what I can do day to day to help.

They are genuine questions, I'm not trying to be goody.

at a time when funding is being cut for DV refuges, reproductive rights are under attack and cuts are hitting women disproportionately.

Won't those things be in jeopardy anyways once "woman" becomes pointless and clever spin of statistics will show "women" winning prizes,awards,competitions, having important positions, being paid the same as men, rise in being perpetrators of DV and sexual attacks etc?

Don't worry Bertrand I wasn't aiming it at you.

You're right about the cake making! How odd. I'm tempted to over think it and come up with all sorts of wild conclusions about the sub text

Yes... perhaps MGTOW have a nice recipe book?

CertainHalfDesertedStreets

The transwoman v woman threads nicely demonstrated sealioning and made me lose the will a little.

No-it means a very specific sort of behaviour. Not just general disapproval

It's justifiable if a woman regardless of sexuality .... colludes with misogyny.

By those definitions Miley Cyrus deserves the appellation for colluding with misogyny, objectification of women and specialisation of children in her videos. I still would not use the term

[I have edited the quote as not sure if "serenade" is a typo]

sexualisation of children

Miley Cyrus was being a fool and acting out her fucked-up confusion publicly on a grand scale - although she shouldn't have given the pervy sex assaulter any oxygen, I don't think she was being the handmaiden. I would say the woman who directed the Blurred Lines video was being a handmaiden though.

@ALunaExplorer
"The Handmaid's Tale is a dystopian novel by Canadian author Margaret Atwood. The book was originally published in 1985. Set in a near-future New England, in a totalitarian, Christian theonomy that has overthrown the United States government. The novel focuses on the journey of the handmaid Offred."
That is the context that you appear to be ignorant of when you object to the behavior being ascribed to a woman.

In my opinion, you are the only one bullying people on this thread. It doesn't work as well on line as it does on person, does it?

I’ve read the whole thread but I’d like to go back to the original question.

I think it’s really important to get back to the fundamentals of feminism.

In the state I live in abortion is still unlawful without a doctor approval.

At least two woman a week are killed by male violence.
The pag gap is about 300 years off being closed.
Black woman are more at risk of jail, being beaten, or having children removed.
Woman still don’t have bodily autonomy in maternity services.

Yes... perhaps MGTOW have a nice recipe book?

There's a whole section on fruitcake, obviously

MGTOW fruitcake, mmmm

What are the biggest issues women currently face then?

I think in the UK it's rape/porn culture. And wifework.
Across the world, probably menstrual taboo and marital slavery.

I saw this the other day

www.indy100.com/article/porn-scripts-metoo-hashtag-men-tell-difference-stories-video-be-frank-8130061

And a nice 'spotted dick' I imagine too

Won't those things be in jeopardy anyways once "woman" becomes pointless and clever spin of statistics will show "women" winning prizes,awards,competitions, having important positions, being paid the same as men, rise in being perpetrators of DV and sexual attacks etc?

Well, exactly. No more gender pay gap. No more chances to get equality impact statements on any policies affecting women disproportionately.

It's deeply frustrating to have to spend so much time on the absolute basics - which is what opposing the TRA agenda amounts to - but if we don't have a sex-based definition of woman, we can't do anything about anything.

It is wrong to call a bisexual person a handmaiden for sleeping with a man because that is not what handmaiden means!

But calling a woman who does all the cooking, shopping, childcare, washing and ironing because she agrees with her husband that it is woman's work while he relaxes playing golf makes sense.

Not sure why this is complicated.