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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

The UK is officially an intolerant hellhole for transwomen

362 replies

pisacake · 12/10/2017 09:31

www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/12/british-transgender-woman-given-residency-in-safer-new-zealand

"The tribunal deemed it would be “unduly harsh” for the woman to be forced to return to the UK, where she suffered years of “persecution” due to her gender identity disorder. "

In pleading for the woman to be allowed to remain in New Zealand, her lawyer, Kar-yen Partington, presented 20 articles to the tribunal detailing transphobic hate crimes in the UK.

Recent data from the UK shows transphobic hate crimes against LGBTQ people have soared by nearly 80% in the last four years, with more than one in five LGBT people being the victim of a hate crime in last 12 months.

Just seriously curious if (actual) women have ever been granted asylum for being subject to harassment, which in some countries is very extreme. Or is this more trans privilege?

OP posts:
QueenOfTheSardines · 16/10/2017 21:58

I'll bet! Must be lovely not to have to worry / mess around with condoms / have hormones etc.

SentimentalLentil · 16/10/2017 22:01

God id love that but we're too young.

QuentinSummers · 16/10/2017 22:07

Brilliant posts queens
lentil are you done with babies? The snip is awesome. Although I give men whining about how traumatic it is short shrift. They are happy enough for us to get our cervices clamped open for a coil with no comment Grin

SentimentalLentil · 16/10/2017 22:08

I've not started with babies.
I'm 30 and pretty sure I don't want one but you never know

QuentinSummers · 16/10/2017 22:10

Ah ok. Snip not the best plan then Grin
Children are lush though, but I have three and would have more if I wasn't crap at giving birth so I am a bit biased

SentimentalLentil · 16/10/2017 22:15

I do like children but work with pregnant women and babies and I see how much hard work they are, I think I like a sit down too much Blush

ALittleBitOfButter · 17/10/2017 07:40

What an excellent analysis Queen. I hope Loop comes back and responds to it.

Datun · 17/10/2017 09:23

QueenOfTheSardines

That analysis is spot on. I was struck, when I read about the 71 different genders, quite how many of them were to do with sex. Who to have it with, when, and why. People having to justify, as you say, not occupying the default male position.

Interestingly, this thread has untangled some of the meanings behind these different gender identities. You have to wonder why so many people want to adopt them. Yes, some of them are snowflakes, but they can’t all be. So a very useful explanation.

In terms of oppression. People are confusing someone not understanding them, or not liking them, or having a negative reaction to them with oppression.

My understanding of oppression is that, apart from being class based, not based on an individual, it requires material gain for the oppressor.

There is no material gain to be had from oppressing people because of their sexual appetite, or because of their transgender status. They might faced discrimination, but not oppression. Although I agree, in terms of the 71 different genders, it’s not something that anybody would know about, unless you told them.

And yes I’m grateful to loops too. It’s still a little frustrating to see gender so centred, but at least now I understand some of the reasons why. And she has been incredibly patient.

BillBrysonsBeard · 17/10/2017 09:47

My trans friend doesn't leave his house in NZ due to getting shouted at on the street. The abuse is far harsher than here.

nauticant · 17/10/2017 16:55

I wondered why I was persisting in reading such a long thread, but I had a feeling that it would get pay off. It didn't let me down. The highlight for me was expecting non-brainwashed people to accept that the term asexual includes people who, when their libido strikes, will have sex but are not that bothered with it being with a particular person. The identity (ie personality) being described is "non-picky" rather than asexual.

The other bonus was the very interesting comments at the end of the thread about labels being used as a sanctuary in a pornified culture.

The one common feature I see in this brave new world of identity is nothing is supposed to mean anything any more except to the person expressing the inexplicable.

BlackForestCake · 18/10/2017 19:06

a group of asexual, teetotal, female vegans might well turn down a heterosexual, male, beer drinking carnivore as a flat mate.

We'd miss out on a 1970s sitcom there though.

TheShaniaTwainExperience · 19/10/2017 12:48

Can I just say first and foremost, loop doesn't speak on behalf of our generation. I'm 24 and do not know of a single person, friend or otherwise, that subscribes to this nonsense. So loop, if you could stop making out that this is a generational issue, that would be really great.

Also, it's great to find women who feel the same way I do. Much love wimms Flowers

Ereshkigal · 19/10/2017 15:08

Yay Shania! Flowers thank you for restoring my belief in the younger generation!

YetAnotherSpartacus · 19/10/2017 15:14

Am I the only one who thought that greysexual meant older people haveing sex?

Knusper · 19/10/2017 15:27

Have relationships, don't have relationships, have sex, don't have sex ... I don't really see the need to come out about it though - just live, why on earth dwell on it so much?

I couldn't agree more. People should conduct their relationships in any legal, consensual way they see fit. Or not, if they're not interested. After that, who cares?

What on earth happened to young people (big generalisation here - sorry Shania!) campaigning on wider issues like poverty, racism, nuclear proliferation, the environment? Identity politics just seems so self focussed.

OneFlewOverTheDodosNest · 19/10/2017 16:18

Knusper I think there's a stronger focus on the younger generation who complain about all these things because they're the ones who make the noise, complaining about "exclusionary" terminology and campaigning to get toilets changed.

Nobody pays attention to the students who volunteer with St John's ambulance because they've always done that, even though they make up a large proportion of the night crew, but if there's a possible headline of the latest crazy thing being pushed by students (even if it's a group of 30 in a whole uni) then that's going to get the focus.

EmpressOfTheSpartacusOceans · 19/10/2017 16:30

Am I the only one who thought that greysexual meant older people haveing sex?

I thought it meant being sexually attracted to older people.

Knusper · 19/10/2017 16:55

OneFlewOverTheDodosNest That was a massive generalisation on my part but I really hope that you're right. I hope that we're just hearing those who shout the loudest.

Datun · 19/10/2017 18:00

I too thought grey sexual was all about Saga generation. Like the grey pound.

I hadn’t thought about as to whether it was the persuer, or the pursued.

Which just goes to show how little I think about any of it.

Gingernaut · 19/10/2017 18:09

Anyone seen the latest news about a 'female' murderer....

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-41671870

HornyTortoise · 19/10/2017 18:25

This thread is so odd. The idea of an assexual person with a high libido is almost as hard to get my head round as female penises to be quite honest...

nauticant · 19/10/2017 19:07

I think the explanation was that for an asexual person, the relevant sexual desire that is lacking is towards a particular person.

It would seem that you can have a woman who is asexual while being hetero-romantic and in a long term relationship with her male partner. At times the asexual woman will have a high libido and thus will have sex with her partner. However, the asexuality comes from her not being that fussed about it being him she's having the sex with.

No, me neither.

Datun · 19/10/2017 19:24

I’m heterosexual, but there are definitely times when I’m asexual.

I’m sure there are for most women.

Smile (but still...)

QueenOfTheSardines · 19/10/2017 19:28

Women's prison for "swifty" I assume...

QuentinSummers · 19/10/2017 19:58

Am I the only one who thought that greysexual meant older people haveing sex? Grin