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Original poster

Irish referendum - abortion - should men vote?

398 replies

Schtinkay · 27/09/2017 09:41

Fabulous news. Finally a referendum in Ireland to decriminalise abortion. About bloody time.

But should men be allowed to vote on an issue that is about controlling rights, freedoms and bodies of women?

I don't think so. Very interested in thoughts.

OP posts:
MrsDustyBusty · 27/09/2017 21:39

I really don't understand why my opinion that the only person who should have any say regarding an abortion is the woman who's deciding whether to have one is insulting.

There's nothing insulting about saying that, but if you're being honest, ypung didn't stop there. Now, I know you don't understand why there's a referendum, that's fine, you don't have to. But it would be useful to find out if you want your views on whether there should be one to be relevant.

NoLoveofMine · 27/09/2017 21:39

PrincessLeia80 under what circumstances should a man be able to prevent a woman from having an abortion?

Elendon · 27/09/2017 21:40

That's what pushes normal men away.

Normal men would understand that this is a woman's issue. They wouldn't be ranting and raving and feeling in any way slighted.

OkPedro · 27/09/2017 21:41

Please tell what these good and bad reasons are leia

NoLoveofMine · 27/09/2017 21:42

There's nothing insulting about saying that, but if you're being honest, ypung didn't stop there. Now, I know you don't understand why there's a referendum, that's fine, you don't have to. But it would be useful to find out if you want your views on whether there should be one to be relevant.

I was posting views on abortion generally. I would have thought that's relevant on a thread about abortion rights.

NoLoveofMine · 27/09/2017 21:43

I was quoting the poster after you NoLove. It was yet another example.

I don't really know why you addressed it to me then nor why you and others are so intent on attacking me for posting views about abortion and that I think only the woman deciding whether to have one has an opinion which is relevant.

Elendon · 27/09/2017 21:55

Abortion is such a hypocritical issue anyway in Ireland. It is criminalised, like this country, UK, and is not supported therefore under medical supervision. In the UK abortion is permitted under the NHS in England, Wales and Scotland, but not Northern Ireland.

However, you are as a female living in Ireland during your reproductive years, allowed to travel outside the country. You would never be prosecuted if you announced you were travelling to have an abortion.

You are allowed to order from online pharmaceuticals in Ireland. No one is going to check your post. You will not be prosecuted.

What a human female of reproductive years is seen as in Ireland is a person who is as equal as an embryo or a fetus in terms of life or death status. There is little room for debate on this because of the 8th amendment. Bear in mind prosecution extends to those who help in the procurement of an abortion.

IfyouseeRitaMoreno · 27/09/2017 21:59

Yeah but if they respected the idea that women should have more say because it’s their bodies they wouldn’t be having this referendum at all.

NoLoveofMine · 27/09/2017 21:59

Now, I know you don't understand why there's a referendum, that's fine, you don't have to.

You can be as patronising as you like but I do now understand. I never meant nor said this specific referendum shouldn't be happening. When I said

No-one should be voting on this at all. There should be no referendum. Abortion rights should be implemented in Ireland without one.

I meant it as an opinion on abortion rights worldwide: no-one should be able to vote on them anywhere as I think they should be a human right for women and girls. I thought this was relevant on a thread about abortion.

One of my closest friend's parents are from India. I regularly talk about feminism there with her, as well as with her mum who knows feminists there when I see her. She often likes to bring this up with me and tell me about it, as I love being able to discuss, despite the fact I obviously have no understanding of it whatsoever compared to her and her mum. I don't know the specifics of the Indian constitution but still feel able to make statements on violence against women for example stemming from something she's told me about an issue there.

I apologise for the statement I made which I quoted above. I didn't mean to come across as if I don't think this referendum should be happening. As I said, I think abortion should be a human right worldwide. I would say abortion laws should be loosened in England and men should have no say on this despite knowing it's impossible for male MPs not to have a vote on it should the issue ever arise.

PrincessLeia80 · 27/09/2017 22:01

OkPedro I believe 95% of the time it's up to the women to choose in my husbands case he had no idea till a year after they split up and then she told him that she only had an abortion to hurt him. They had rekindled things and when it didn't work out his ex told my husband that "she would get pregnant again and have another abortion if he left her!" This was when he found out she had aborted their child,

stitchglitched · 27/09/2017 22:02

Leia what if her reason is that she doesn't want to go through an unwanted pregnancy?

Elendon · 27/09/2017 22:05

This is the third referendum on the issue. Roughly one every 10 years since the 8th amendment.

I think respect for women is way down on the agenda.

Elendon · 27/09/2017 22:10

You know I couldn't give a shiny shite about men and their feelings about their ex's and the angst regarding their having unprotected sex with a female of reproductive years.

Men who freely give their sperm away, shouldn't cry over the consequences.

Miffer · 27/09/2017 22:21

PrincessLeia

I have to say that is the crappest "immoral abortion" story I have ever heard. Put some effort in for fucks sake.

BrandNewHouse · 27/09/2017 22:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FlaviaAlbia · 27/09/2017 22:27

I think you need to stop taking things so personally NoLove

I am not attacking you. I am attempting to explain why people might have reacted they way they did to the statement No-one should be voting on this at all. There should be no referendum. Abortion rights should be implemented in Ireland without one.

You said I thought opinions were part of discussing issues but okay which I took as a rather passive aggressive question about why people did react like that.

Missymoo100 · 27/09/2017 22:29

Stitchedglitch-
Leia what should happen if the woman wants to have an abortion and the father is against it?

This isn't about individual cases, it's about an issue that affects society as a whole

stitchglitched · 27/09/2017 22:31

Yes MissyMoo but discussions evolve and Leia was suggesting that men do have a say in individual cases.

OkPedro · 27/09/2017 22:31

Elendon Did you mean you can order abortion pills on line and have them delivered to NI? It's not possible in the republic.

Agree with leia's "abortion story" being absolutely ridiculous Confused

GetYourRosariesOffMyOvaries · 27/09/2017 22:36

I don't think they should. It is a women's isssue and in 99% of cases it's the woman left holding the baby from the smaller things like having to go part time or become a SAHP to the larger things like being left to raise a child alone.

I can't stand the terms and conditions people spout when this subject arises "well it's ok if it's rape" "not used as contraception" ehh €500 quick glorified morning after pill and people really still think this, or my personal favourite "abortion on demand" the imagery of us Irish women still overcoming years of catholic guilt etc going in banging our fists demanding abortions week after week!

Missymoo100 · 27/09/2017 22:38

under what circumstances should a man be able to prevent a woman from having an abortion?

in the interest of ethics, surely men and women should be able to have a voice?
i think it's quite narrow minded to suggest only women should have a say on this, but then again that's typical of modern feminism.

BrandNewHouse · 27/09/2017 22:40

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Missymoo100 · 27/09/2017 22:43

Brand Newhouse- I disagree, I think some aspects of modern feminism are incredibly introspective- they don't speak for the population as a whole, women included and is divisive.

Jaybee99 · 27/09/2017 23:16

This should be about women only. Men don't face the bloody consequences!

BarbarianMum · 28/09/2017 00:06

The rules that govern society as a whole are made by society as a whole - or should be, because ultimately we are governed by consent.

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