Why are feminists so aggressive?

[BertrandRussell]

This, or something like it, it always being asked. People say that the FWR board on here is scary and hounds out people whose faces don't fit. That women are always being told they can't be feminists if.......And so on. And so on.

In my experiences, you are much more likely to get an aggressive response if you express a feminist point of view than the other way round. Is it just me? Or am I missing something?

There have been plenty of interesting feminists threads recently, where everyone seems to be holding their own- but the same old accusations keep coming up.

The argument about 'staunch' is weird and pointless IMO.

Oh Lordy lord we off on a silly tangent again....

Just wanted to add in reply to an earlier post was thinking about it and sometimes handmaiden and cool wife is the only way to describe some women accurately. Like all the cool women on another gender neutral bathroom thread who have to make their point that they have no problem sharing a loo, or striping off naked, or changing tampons etc with men around and the rest of us are just so silly and pathetic and need to grow up. It's not even what the thread was about, the point was turning all the female bathrooms gender neutral and keeping the men's the same. So that's the cool wives/ friend.

So far as handmaidens are concerned I encountered plenty of this type while I was part of an extremely strict Islamic group and experiencing domestic violence. These are the type who would say about fb that they don't blame the man for hitting some women and if you spoke to them about a problem would tell you to please your husband or go and inform on you. Handmaidens is the perfect word for those silly bitches.

So now I have gone off on a tangent too!

DV not fb

What is the definition of 'aggressive', though? Aggressive men beat people up, pull knives, kill, take over countries. Aggressive feminists answer back, argue logically and stand up for their convictions when challenged. That's exactly the same thing.

We aren't aggressive just passionate in my view, but as I have said people expect us to be complete witches so take any sort of a disagreement as proof of that and cannot see that they are the rude aggressive ones. That's my experience on YouTube anyway.

Thanks Gallicos for getting this back on track!

The argument about 'staunch' is weird and pointless IMO

It has certainly been weird.

What I find weird is that on trans threads here there is the insistence that words have meanings; words can't change just to suit the user. But apparently they can depending on the user.

Seachangeshell used this word in the normal dictionary sense and in a sense in which one will find tons of examples, on Mumsnet itself, on all manner of subjects, by posters using it to describe themselves.

AssignedPerfect decided it has a far more limited and pejorative use and piled on to Seachangeshell for using it. Elendon apparently doesn't know how the search function on the forum works(but can see imaginary references to the Daily Mail)

I found it hypocritical- not pointless. Aggressively insisting they were right, and presumably every other poster on Mumsnet who has used this word was wrong. And no one, including you, who described yourself as a staunch feminist saying anything.

Might have been nice to have given Seachangeshell a bit of support when she was having a strip torn off her for using the same expression as you did - but possibly you missed her posts.

Gallico refers to "arguing logically". I am not seeing any logic here. I am seeing arrogance and hypocrisy.

Sorry Titania you probably think I have derailed it again. You might think it was a silly tangent. I don't. Ignore if you like. I still think there has been a Humpty Dumpty attitude to language.

Top feministsplaining though I think that sums it up. Or the opposite.
No explanation at all. I once asked about the differences between radical and liberal feminism and was told to Google it.
I'm a practical person. I like to hear about real life examples of how people apply feminism and see where they have made real change in every day life. It's all very theoretical here.

I don't care if people are aggressive because it will never usually upset me and I never respond in kind.

Why are feminists held to much higher standards than any other group on Mumsnet? They're not. I think you all take yourselves far too seriously.

I'm coming to this thread late because it took me ages to read it so apologies if I'm skipping back to previous points.

I'm with previous posters, it's bizarre to see this board described as aggressive when it doesn't have a fraction of the aggression of AIBU, which seems to exist now purely so that people can get their aggression out as fast as possible. I'd never direct any new post there but I would tell them the debates here make interesting reading.

anti male vitriol
I suppose in a way it's natural to be defensive if you're a mother of sons, but taking statistics personally isn't going to start many interesting discussions.

derxa

Why are feminists held to much higher standards than any other group on Mumsnet?

"They're not. I think you all take yourselves far too seriously."

Many of the women on here are bloody funny. Being a feminist does not preclude you from having a sense of humour, contrary to what people think. I, myself, am fricken hilarious.

The nature of the threads, however, will preclude flippancy. You can't have a piss take on the side, because both the subject of the thread and the people replying, will take the issue seriously. Given that many threads are about what women suffer at the hands of men, it's a big mistake to suddenly start taking the piss.

It's also ironic, that two thirds of this thread was taken up by someone else misinterpreting a flippant comment and calling it offensive.

But yeah, you stick to your theory the feminists are not held to a higher standard than everyone else.

I've been busy with work so have missed a lot of the recent threads but my experience hasn't been great.

On one thread someone must have googled my username and read all my previous posts on MN and accused me of being a troll and a man. Just for having a contrary, liberal feminist viewpoint.

Hang on, thephonywar- I was recently in a long and interesting thread with you about liberal/radical feminism. Lots of discussion-some of it robust. But mostly perfectly polite and respectful. Was that "not great"? Or have I got the wrong person?

You've been great Bertrand and there has been some very interesting discussions here, with you and others. However it's not great when some posters Google your history and then try and accuse you of being a troll or a man, just because you voice different views.

I'm fine with 'robust' discussion. I can be quite argumentative, I don't mind that on either side. That's health debate.

Just on the 'staunch' thing ... I did get confused, but I did add that I didn't find 'staunch' to be pejorative and I did say that I thought that seashell was hard done by (although I was rather confused so possibly not as staunchly as I would have done if I had understood exactly what was going on).

although I was rather confused so possibly not as staunchly as I would have done if I had understood exactly what was going on).

Am I the only one who now can't say staunch without it sounding like a word I've just made up?

Dunno - I keep thinking of ROOOOUND words like paunch...

and did anyone actually find the Python sketch?

I can only think of the one about GORNE.

I wasn't digging at you Lass I wasn't even quite sure who started the staunch debate. Staunch just means staunch to me, dictionary definition so I just skimmed over that part of the thread and didn't read it properly, I was getting confused as to who was arguing with who!

You have been here a lot longer than me, I wouldn't be rude like that.

Titania but no apology needed.

I was actually trying an apology to you as I hadn't noticed you had posted Thanks Gallicos for getting this back on track! when I immediately followed you and sent it back where it had been, which made my long post look a bit sarky.

Oh I see! I thought you might be a bit fucked off as well because of my post saying I like using the terms handmaidens etc for some women and then my post about thread going off track. But all is good it seems!

Staunch to me means, as a person who grew up a Catholic in Northern Ireland, Orange Order. Every time I see the word 'staunch' I think of this. I was terrified growing up during the 'Troubles'.

Elendon I am sorry that you personally are upset by that word and my apologies if it upset you.

However your personal experience does not change its meaning to the very limited usage you were arguing for, which is clearly not the case as any Google search or a search of this forum will show. On the Catholic /Protestant issue Google shows it is used for and by both sides. Nor does it justify your claims that I was citing the Daily Mail.

It is not a word I'm likely to use , other than possibly Scottish independence threads, and given your explanation will not use it on a thread you are on.

Because we fucking rock.