Aibu to think rape is not merely about power and sometimes is just about sex?

[CheeseBubbles]

I see it said a lot and I'm not convinced. If rape is solely about power there's no point teaching men about consent is there? If anything they might use the knowledge to better abuse their victims. Isn't it possible that for some men they simply want sex and don't actually give a shit one way or another what the victim is thinking. On the relationship board you'll see men who try it on nicely at first and then move on to coercion which makes me think again that this is just sex for them because they'd happily get it the easy way if possible. I don't know if it really makes a difference but I worry that if we assign this one motivation to it we draw a line that doesn't really need to be there and maybe make men who used garden variety coercion or a really drunk woman to think they didn't actually rape, because for them it wasn't a power trip.

Why is this thread all about you, Scrumple?

I don't see how the entire psychological understanding of how abusers operate should be ignored just because you don't think various methods of gaining power over victims are not really power at all.

I think 101 things that aren't really true just to get me through the day; it's a well known part of recovering from abuse, but I don't expect them to be of use to other people in dangerous situations.

"Aibu to think rape is not merely about power and sometimes is just about sex?"

There is a lot of research on this this topic over the past 40 years. As usual with human behaviour, there are a variety of different theories. For those interested it's worthwhile to google "groth rape power" for the rape-power perspective, e.g., csom.org/train/etiology/4/4_1.htm

One the other hand there are theories more in the rape-sex-biology perspective. Google "Natural History of Rape Thornhill".

Writing as a person who was raped by a stranger many years ago while in college, looking back I see relevant things in both perspectives. I'm sure it will be different for others. In my case looking back I can see the rapist wanted sexual pleasure, he used power to get that. For me it was terrifying, I was powerless.

Again, on a personal note, I think that people often weigh up risk-reward as we do things. For me the balance is all wrong for such a serious crime as rape. The risk of being caught is tiny, the penalty light, there really is insufficient deterrent.

to speak about my experiences is harmful.

I never once said that. I said that encouraging a belief that rape is not about power is harmful. Not that you can't frame it any way that makes sense to you personally and speak about it. But it is just your opinion, based on semantics. All rape is about power. Domination over another human being is central to the act.

One the other hand there are theories more in the rape-sex-biology perspective. Google "Natural History of Rape Thornhill".

I've read that and it is awful. Definitely not something feminists would appreciate. They think women are asking for it by giving men signals with their clothing and behaviour and that evolutionary psychology backs it up.

All rape happens because the perpetrator feels he has power over his victim. The motivation to rape might be mainly that power, or his feeling of entitlement to sex might allow him to use that power to disregard the victims enjoyment, but one way or another it's the power that gets him off.
No man or boy " can't " stop having sex when asked. I remember being 17 and stopping my boyfriend right at the crucial moment, after lots of foreplay. He was about to penetrate, I said " stop" . He stopped (and ran to the bathroom )
If a 17 year old boy can stop, any man can stop. My dp now could if he wanted force me physically if I changed my mind halfway through. He could presend he didn't realise or was too horny to stop. But he wouldn't. Because men who are not rapists choose not to exert physical power over their sexual partners. The moment and man decides to ignore the fact that his partner is not enjoying it is the moment he is getting of on power and is a rapist.
So whether he is a serial violent stranger rapist , or your lovely boyfriend, power and control can't NOT be the motivation in rape.

Are you the type of rapist who gets off on raping people or the type who gets off while raping people. The distinction is wafer thin.

Yeah, this exactly!

"That is not how anyone else sees it. Saying "all rape is about power" does not mean that."

Right, so I'm the only person in the world who saw it that way, and was harmed because of that?

I thought it meant that when I started to read this thread, and was interested to read the responses. I understood that 'rape is about power' didn't mean the motivation was sadism just by reading half of the first page.

Reading your posts (and the thread in general), Scrumple, it struck me that everyone has been talking at cross-purposes and the thread has been one long derailment purely because you either didn't bother to read others' posts, or possibly didn't fully understand them, before you jumped in with your views. I'm not sure why you didn't go back and re-read (or read for the first time) when so many people were disagreeing with you, and you couldn't work out why that was.

The part that I'm not sure about is why scrumple's experience would be easier to process if she thought power was the means, not part of the motivation.

It feels as though there is an element that has to be minimised in order to accept what happened.

That is why it feels wrong.

Only rapists know why they do it. My guess is it's complicated and not easily explained. Just saying POWER is too simplistic.
There may be a sexual element to it, may not be.
It's wrong eirher way and I'd rather people DID NOT rape others.